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machinehead61
June 13th, 2012, 03:02 PM
I have joined here to find help in my Whitcomb research. I plan on writing a book since none exists for the Whitcomb locomotive history. I recently did a display at the 7th annual Rochelle Railroad Days where I did a photo opp with a former Whitcomb employee whom I have interviewed45951 and have located other former employees. I have access to the microfilm in our library that contain newspaper stories on the Whitcomb but the mother load of company files ended up in the California State Railroad Museum. I don't have the money to travel to CSRM and spend the time needed to research their archives. I hope to find a member near the CSRM who could go through their archives for me. The librarian has told me she doesn't have the time to go through all of the Whitcomb records. They built over 5,000 locomotives between 1906-1952 and cataloged each loco on an index card. The index cards alone fill 12-14 boxes according to the librarian. If you can help please message me.

Steve

BoxcabE50
June 13th, 2012, 03:25 PM
Welcome to TrainBoard!

Quite a project you are taking on. Hope it all comes together!

machinehead61
June 13th, 2012, 04:00 PM
Welcome to TrainBoard!

Quite a project you are taking on. Hope it all comes together!I just got off the phone with a very helpful young lady at the Army Transportation Museum and she just sent me these photos.

45956


During WW II, Whitcombs were used in Africa and Europe:

WHITCOMBDOING THE IMPOSSIBLE


“Duringthe latter part of 1940 we were asked to design a locomotive whichcould operate successfully through desert sand storms and keep coolwith the thermometer registering 125 F. in the shade. The only otherknown factors, besides the gauge of track was that they needed allthe power we could give them but the weight had to be reduced to theabsolute minimum. That is just about as contradictory as wanting thestrength of a draft horse in a Shetland pony. As the boys in theengineering department were only working about 60 hours a week atthat time, they decided there wasn't any particular reason why wecouldn't tackle the problem. By actual count there are 10,756different items necessary to build that Diesel electric locomotive,and the fact it is still in production offers conclusive proof thatthe engineers did their work well. Incidentally, in that count theBuda diesels, Westinghouse Electric Equipment, the Young Radiators and all other materials purchased in a finished state are merelyfigured as individual items. The balance had to be designed,detailed, weights estimated, purchased, machined, fabricated,assembled, crated and the completed product sent on its way. Wereceived the actual contract shortly before Christmas and the firstunits were operating in Egypt the following May. That is less thanhalf the normal time required on a completely new design. Certainlythere isn't much I could say to further emphasizes the splendidspirit of cooperation which not only exists within the Whitcomborganization but also extends out among all of our suppliers. Theyhave done a grand job and all of us know it.”


H.G. Heulguard
VicePresident, General Manager
WhitcombLocomotive Company
TheRochelle News, January 26, 1944


ARMY-NAVY“E” AWARD


Becauseof the outstanding performance that the Whitcomb Locomotive Companyachieved in war production, on December 31, 1943 the War Departmentconferred the Army-Navy “E” Award – the highest honor possible– to the Whitcomb Company and its employees.


Steve


HOWTO HIDE A 65 TON LOCOMOTIVE


“WhitcombDiesel locomotives built here in Rochelle have played an importantpart in this war on almost every front. Being smokeless and easy tocamouflage against air attacks these locomotives have beenextensively used where standard coal burning locomotives provedimpractical.
Inour January 12th 1945, issue of the Leader we printed aninterview with W.F. Eckert, chief engineer at Whitcomb in which hetold how Whitcomb built locomotives had solved the English andAmerican transprtation problem in north Africa, German bombers hadblasted most of the regular locomotives as their smoke was easilyspotted by the fliers.
RochelleWhitcomb Diesel locomotives were then camouflged as regular box cars.In the make up of trains the location of the “ box-car-locomotive”was constantly changed to elude the Germans in their bombingattacks.
Theplan proved very successful, and it has been credited as one of themajor forces in the Briritsh success in the drive from Egypt toTunisla during the latter four months of 1942 and early 1943.”


TheRochelle Leader
May4, 1945

machinehead61
June 13th, 2012, 04:10 PM
Hot off the press from the Army Transportation museum:

45957

This is a 65 ton Whitcomb - the first Allied locomotive to enter Germany during the war. I have read references to Whitcombs being the first locomotives to enter Rome and Paris after liberation but can't verify.

Steve

Eagle2
June 13th, 2012, 08:11 PM
I'd say that's quite a project you have. Fascinating bits about the history with the military. Good luck to you!

E-8
June 13th, 2012, 10:46 PM
Welcome aboard. We hope to see how you progress on your project.

Charlie

fitz
June 14th, 2012, 02:55 AM
Wish I still lived in Cali and could help you. You might want to contact them again, as they have docents who might be willing to search the records for you.

machinehead61
June 14th, 2012, 03:02 AM
I'd say that's quite a project you have. Fascinating bits about the history with the military. Good luck to you!Thank you. I had no idea how interesting the project would become when I started.

Steve

machinehead61
June 14th, 2012, 03:06 AM
Welcome aboard. We hope to see how you progress on your project.

CharlieThank you. I just got another call tonight and an interview/breakfast appointment on Saturday from a vet who was stationed at Pearl Harbor. He says that Whitcombs were deployed at Pearl to load ammunition to the ships at battleship row during WW II. He helped restore and run those left on the island and even has a manual buried somewhere. Says I might contact the naval station there for historical photos. He thinks that some might exist of the Whitcombs from the war.

Steve

machinehead61
June 14th, 2012, 03:12 AM
Wish I still lived in Cali and could help you. You might want to contact them again, as they have docents who might be willing to search the records for you.I plan on calling them again. A docent would be fantastic if I can locate one. Another photo:

45971


This is the same photo that was sent from the Transportation Museum (Fort Eustis, Virginia) that was sent to the Rochelle paper from the war department in 1945.

Steve

Ironhorseman
June 14th, 2012, 01:52 PM
A very great and worthy project, Steve. Welcome to Trainboard. :)

machinehead61
June 15th, 2012, 02:08 AM
A very great and worthy project, Steve. Welcome to Trainboard. :)Thank you. Still no member coming forward from California. Not sure where would be the best place to post the "help wanted" in this forum to get the best chance of finding someone.

Another photo:
45989

A resident here had tipped me off on Whitcombs being used on the Panama Canal. A google search led me to this add in a trade magazine from July 1922. This was before Baldwin bought the company in 1931.

Steve

machinehead61
June 16th, 2012, 04:20 AM
46011

This is an aerial photo of the Whitcomb factory in Rochelle IL circa 1930s.

46012

A group photo of Whitcomb employees inside the factory sometime after 1920.

46013
Whitcomb secretaries about the same time frame as above.

Steve

machinehead61
June 17th, 2012, 03:00 AM
I had breakfast with a gentleman who was living in Hawaii and helped restore and operate Whitcomb diesels there. I called out there and have a lead on possible photos of Whitcombs operating at Pearl Harbor during WW II. Waiting for an email.

A call to the California Railroad Museum's librarian about the possibility of moving the Whitcomb records back to Rochelle has me waiting for an email from their board.

And for some reason I can't load any photos into my posts.

Steve

machinehead61
July 2nd, 2012, 03:26 AM
Just found this in the local microfilm archives:

Rochelle Knows Him Well As Engineer,Inventor and Its Own Portrait Painter
Wm. F. Eckert Looks Back On UnusualCareer
The Rochelle Leader, January 12, 1943


William Frederick Eckert was never ableto make up his mind whether to stick to machine tools or paintbrushes, that's why Rochelle knows him as an engineer and as anartist.


As an immigrant boy he came with hisparents from Germany, they landed in Philadelphia on his tenthbirthday, October 5, 1888, and the family settled in Bartlett, asmall town near Elgin, Ill.


It was the year after the greatColumbian Exposition in Chicago that young Eckert sought into theworld metropolis to carve out a life career. What it was to be he didnot know. He liked to paint but he also liked to work with tools. Aneconomic set back hit Chicago after the world's fair but he obtaineda job as apprentice in a machine shop to earn his daily keep.Evenings he used to study. Some were utilized to home study ofmechanical engineering courses from the International CorrespondenceSchool, while other evenings were devoted to study of painting at theChicago Art Institute.


Four years later Eckert found himselftoo preoccupied learning tool and die making in the machine shop anddevoting spare time to inventions that he was obliged to give up hisstudies at the art school.


Shortly after the turn of the centuryhe invented a machine for filling powder into cans for the makers ofGreve's Tooth Powder, and was employed by the company for a year anda half. Through the president of the company he met William C.Whitcomb of the Whitcomb Locomotive Works.


When Eckert went to work for Whitcombthe company was specializing in knitting machines and pneumaticmining machinery. He entered the company as blueprint boy and chiefengineer, in short he was the whole engineering department. About1906, Eckert invented and built the first gasoline internalcombustion powered locomotive, originally designed for use in coalmines.


In the meantime Eckert had quite a dealto do with the improvement of the knitting machines, which at thattime had its largest customer in the Vassar Knitting Company ofRochelle. Many of the machines are still in use. In 1907, Whitcombdecided to move from Chicago to Rochelle and the first factory wasopened in the building now used by the Rochelle Furniture Co. Herethe company grew in activity, shifting steadily from knittingmachinery to stressing production of mining machinery and gasolinelocomotives, and then in 1912 specializing only in the building oflocomotives.


The company built its first shop on thepresent site in 1912, and the engineering staff was increased, firstwith a boy to develop blue prints and then with a draftsman.


The locomotive works received its firstreal spurt during the first world war. The warring nations discoveredthe advantages of a smokeless locomotive and orders poured in. Francewas the biggest customer before our own country entered the war.


The tempo of production continuedsteady from 1916 to the outbreak of the present war, but for a slowdown during the depression of the early '30s. The annual productionran from 200 to 300 locomotives a year. With the outbreak of thepresent war the production was vastly increased, as the smokelesslocomotive proved an essential motive power less likely to be spottedby enemy aircraft. The size of the locomotive was increased, and thecompany found it both practical and economical to sublet theproduction of the engines. In January, 1944, the company was awardedthe Army-Navy “E” for having attained the record of maintainingan average daily production of one 65 ton locomotive a day.


Past and present employees of theWhitcomb company may feel sure that they could spot one of thecompany's locomotives anywhere in the world, but we doubt that theywould be able to spot them in use during the final stages of theAfrican campaign. The German fliers bombed the locomotives andconsequently immobilized the British trains. The problem was solvedby camouflaging the Whitcomb locomotives as box cars and shiftingtheir location in the makeup of the trains.


The reason we tell so much about thelocomotives is that Eckert is the chief engineer at Whitcomb. He madethe original invention, has added a good half a dozen patents oflocomotive inventions, besides the almost daily improvements thathave been made. Among the additional patents may be mentioned thenon-explosive locomotive for use in mines.


The present gasoline internalcombustion powered locomotive is a long step ahead of the first onethat Eckert built in Chicago in 1906. The first ones had noself-starter, as Lloyd Koritz, chemist at Cal-Pack will tell you; heused “to get a kick out of running one of them down in southernIllinois.”


Eckert made his home in Rochelle from1907 to 1932, but for an interval of one and a half years that he waslocated in Milwaukee. In '32 the Baldwin company, which had takenover the interests in the Whitcomb, transferred Eckert toPhiladelphia, but in 1939 he was returned here as chief engineer.


During his first stay here he found anoutlet for his artistic talent in portrait photography, especially intaking pictures of children. He recalls with pleasure how some of thechildren, that he photographed in rompers, today are married and havechildren of their own. Yes, he did some painting too. Some landscapesand some portraits, but he didn't take the painting serious. It wasnot until he went to Philadelphia that his interest in painting wasreawakened.


There he met Clyde O. Deland, an artistspecializing in painting historical personalities. His paintings havebeen exhibited in national art shows in Washington. A warm friendshipblossomed and Deland kindled Eckert's enthusiasm for painting andtaught him many modern techniques of the art.


Mr. Eckert tells us that he has paintedabout 15 portraits the past couple of years. In 1942 he exhibitedabout 15 of his paintings at the Flagg Township public library, andin 1943, at a Past Masters night of the local Masons, he presentedportraits he had painted of Manuel Hill and J. E. Barber. Both were50 year Masons, and Hill had presented the site for the presentMasonic temple. Eckert is himself a Past Master of Horicon lodge anda Past Worthy Patron of the Eastern Star and a member of TebalaShrine in Rockford.


Among his portrait paintings heconsiders his last two, one of Mr. Stofer of the Stofer China Companyin Chicago, and one of George May of the George May Electric Companyin Rockford, among his best.


Eckert's portraits are noted for theirtrueness to life and their reflection of the personality andcharacter of the subject. His mastery of colors combined with a blendof the exactness of the engineer with the touch of the artist havebrought remarkable results.


The beautiful home at 510 No. Seventhstreet reflects the artistic good taste of Mr. Eckert and his wife,the former Laura J. Newton. The decorative scheme is rich and warm,blended harmoniously in details to create an effect of welcomefriendliness.


In the basement he has his studio. Itis impressive, not by its size, but by its arrangement of lights andtechnical equipment. In an adjoining room he has a complete workshop,and when he tires of painting he seeks relaxation among his tools andmachinery.


The neighbors didn't appreciate it, buthis son, Fred, did and when Eckert built an amateur radio sending andreceiving set, Fred obtained the first amateur radio operator'slicense in Rochelle. He sent and received messages from all parts ofthe world – the neighbors got static.


The neighbors and friends, however,appreciated Eckert's adventures in boat building and enjoyed many aride. He built one boat driven by an airplane propeller that heoperated on the Rock river, and a gasoline powered launch and a sailboat operated on Lake Geneva. The sail boat was moved to LakeMichigan after his sons settled in Chicago.


Eckert has three sons, William (Bill)with the Harris Trust Company in Chicago, Orren (Bud) formerly withMontgomery Ward in Chicago and now in the navy, and Frederick (Fred)formerly sales manager with the Fee-Stemwedel Company of Chicago andnow in the army.


Fred invented a very importantinstrument used by the navy and was about to be commissioned anofficer in the navy when he was drafted into the army. Since the warbroke out the father has invented a special lift of great value tothe navy.


The “Who Is Who In Industry andCommerce” devotes a sizeable space to a report on Eckert'sengineering and inventing activities, but does not mention his art atall. We therefore consider it a natural question to ask what heconsiders the most beautiful sight he has ever seen.


“The bobbing light in the caps of acouple of mine inspectors,” is his surprising answer.


He goes on to explain that during theearly deliveries of locomotives to mining companies, he had to go tothe mines to demonstrate and run the locomotives. At that time theyhad found no means of controlling the gas fumes. One day he entered amine with a severe headache, and before the day was done he was justabout overcome by the gas fumes.


He chose to stay in the coal minerather than return to the surface, and over tired as he was he bunkedhimself on straw in a mule stall. He was left without a light, it waspitch dark, and he fell asleep. Shortly he awoke abruptly bysomething gnawing at his shoes. A big rat ran over his chest and hejumped to his feet. Zhe spent the rest of the night standing up,continuously swinging his feet to keep the rats away. The nightseemed endless. He dared not leave the place for fear of getting lostin the mine tunnels. At last a light, then another , flickering andbobbing slowly down the tunnel toward him.


“I have never seen a more beautifulsight.”

machinehead61
July 23rd, 2012, 06:10 PM
Success on one search !

>>> steve oconnor <oconnorsteve61@gmail.com> 07/12/12 15:43 >>>

Chicago National Archives;

My name is Steve O'Connor and I am researching the history of the George D.
Whitcomb Company of Rochelle (Ogle County) Illinois. I have a letter
written by the company accountant that states Geo. D. Whitcomb Co. went
bankrupt in 1931 and that the Baldwin Locomotive Works gained control of
the assets and changed the name to Whitcomb Locomotive Company - a
subsidiary of Baldwin. It remained in business until 1952 in Rochelle when
Balwin closed the factory and moved the assets to Pennsylvania. If you can
find and verify the bankruptcy case and any details of why the bankruptcy
occured and how Baldwin gained control it would be of great importance to
my research and possible book on the history of said company. I'm attaching
two scans of adds. One before and one after the name change.
Thank you for you help.

Steve O'Connor
128 south 10th street
Rochelle, IL
61068

This email just came today:

Dear Mr. O'Connor:

Your request was forwarded to me. I was able to look in the dockets for the U.S. District Court in Freeport, Illinois, and find the case you wanted. It is number 2065, originally filed 3/5/31.

The majority of our bankruptcy cases are located at an off-site storage facility in Kansas. I will request the case be returned for your review and let you know when it arrives. You will then be able to make an appointment to look at the case. Or you may want to request a photocopy of the case; we charge 75 cents per page for copies.

If you do want to come and see the case, you will have to fill out a researcher application form to receive a researcher card and review instructions on how to use NARA documents. Typically it only takes a few days for files to be sent from the off-site facility; I will let you know when it arrives.

Thank you for your interest in the National Archives and Records Administration.

Katie Dishman
Archives Technician
National Archives and Records Administration
7358 S. Pulaski Road
Chicago, IL 60629

Now the wait for the docket to arrive in Chicago.

Steve

machinehead61
July 28th, 2012, 08:02 AM
Dear Mr. O'Connor: Well, it certainly was quick. The case arrived today. It is in six large envelopes; two of them are filled with (I think) canceled checks. I am estimating there are about 1000 pages, so you may want to make an appointment to come to the archives as I wrote you previously. We are open Monday-Friday from 8:00-4:15. You may bring a digital camera to take photos, or you can request certain pages to be photocopied for 75 cents per page.

Regards,

Katie Dishman
Archives Technician

I go see the docket on Monday.

Steve

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 01:26 AM
I went in to the National Archives in Chicago and spent about 4 hours sifting through the bankruptcy case and got about half way through it on Monday.

What I discovered caught me completely by surprise.

It appeared that the Vice President of Whitcomb had been illegally transfering funds from the Company account to his personal account to the sum of $75,000 and had spent at least a portion of that on stock purchases in the 18 months before the bankruptcy.

Also, the three banks in Rochelle were also involved and aware of the illegal nature of the fund transfers and two of the banks and the George D. Whitcomb Company went bankrupt.

Prior to the bankruptcy, the Geo. D. Whitcomb Company had approached Baldwin for a loan. On December 24, 1930 Whitcomb had issued Baldwin a promissory note for $125,000 to be paid back at 5 1/2% interest making Baldwin the largest creditor when Geo. D. Whitcomb Co. declared bankruptcy on March 5, 1931.

On April 13, 1931 the Whitcomb Locomotive Company (incorporated in Delaware by Baldwin) purchased the assets of the George D. Whitcomb Company for $257,000. The assets were valued at $657,446 with liabilities of $536,295.

Thus Baldwin became owner of Whitcomb.

I have digital photo copies of these court documents but I can't seem to load them in this forum. I've posted some on my Facebook page.

Steve

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 01:35 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/484598_335583229863269_2025405481_n.jpg

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 01:38 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/555671_335583643196561_1502426744_n.jpg

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 01:43 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/268305_335602043194721_1882022351_n.jpg

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 01:48 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/553450_335603043194621_671937604_n.jpg

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 02:38 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/376753_335612829860309_933007686_n.jpg

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 02:42 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/625590_335613243193601_1657885856_n.jpg

This is the $125,000 dollar question:

WHY DID BALDWIN LOAN $125,000 TO A COMPETING LOCOMOTIVE BUILDER ?

Steve

machinehead61
August 1st, 2012, 02:59 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/s720x720/268223_335616296526629_1695955227_n.jpg

If I understand this document correctly, at least 5 officers of the Geo. D. Whitcomb Co. owed over $100,000 to the company.

Just about what Baldwin loaned them.

Did Baldwin officers loan the money to Whitcomb to privately invest Baldwin money in the stock market for private gain - which the Whitcomb officers would share ? All under the table ?

Steve

machinehead61
August 3rd, 2012, 03:59 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s720x720/486597_336277399793852_1504204774_n.jpg

Here the referee of the bankruptcy states that illegal fund transfers were performed by the Rochelle banks taking money out of Whitcomb accounts and into private accounts of company officers.

machinehead61
August 3rd, 2012, 04:11 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/562693_336280216460237_1566517788_n.jpgHere the trustee is explaining that they will put the Rochelle bank out of business if they try to settle for the full amount owed.

machinehead61
August 3rd, 2012, 04:14 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/553368_336281166460142_273161760_n.jpg

Here are the checks that the bank should never had allowed to be processed.

machinehead61
August 3rd, 2012, 04:21 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/396807_336281913126734_48770070_n.jpg

Paragraph 9 says it all - if they pursue full recovery of the full amount, the bank will be forced to close for good.

machinehead61
August 3rd, 2012, 04:24 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/409673_336283106459948_2119320127_n.jpg

The trustee agrees to settle for the reduced amount and allow the bank to reorganize.

machinehead61
August 7th, 2012, 01:51 AM
Today I found out that William C. Whitcomb, President of the George D. Whitcomb Company that his father started, saw the "generous loan" from Baldwin for $125,000 as part of a darker agenda . . . sinking his company into bankruptcy and then buying it for less than half its value . . .

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/s720x720/255262_337526269668965_1621137176_n.jpg

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s720x720/384750_337528216335437_87008814_n.jpg

machinehead61
August 7th, 2012, 01:59 AM
W. C. Whitcomb filed suit against Baldwin in Cook County Circuit Court (Chicago) in an attempt to intervene in the bankruptcy proceedings.

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/549623_337529573001968_1099014946_n.jpg

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/386966_337530419668550_1083871490_n.jpg

machinehead61
August 7th, 2012, 02:16 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/484620_337533756334883_1119675271_n.jpg

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s720x720/406250_337534606334798_44378484_n.jpg

Basically, Baldwin had purchased 3,500 shares of the 3,800 class "A" preferred stock and 22,500 of the 50,000 common stock and held a stock holder meeting and loaded the 7 Whitcomb Board of Directors with 3 Baldwin employees. Then they asked Baldwin for a $125,000 loan and as a condition of the loan, placed a 4th Baldwin employee onto the board giving Baldwin majority control of the board of directors. Then they had the company audited a month before the $125,000 promisory note was due, declared the company insolvent - because of the $125,000 outstanding promisory note - and filed for bankruptcy. Then Baldwin purchased the company assets for $257,000 when the company was valued at over $600,000.

Neat swindle.

machinehead61
August 7th, 2012, 02:42 AM
On February 14, 1934 William C. Whitcomb filed suit in Cook County (Chicago) against Baldwin - case # 34C 1936.

My next search will be Cook County court records to see if case# 34C 1936 has been saved.

Steve

machinehead61
August 7th, 2012, 02:59 AM
Another side note - the former George D. Whitcomb treasurer - Carl Heim - had a warrant issued for his arrest on the charge of embezzlement after the bankruptcy trustee discovered the $75,000 missing and the illegal fund transferes in the Rochelle banks. But before the March 5, 1931 declaration of bankruptcy Heim went into hiding. In the May 31, 1931 Rochelle News it stated that Carl Heim had been arrested in Tennessee, extradited to Ogle County jail in Illinois and released on $15,000 bond.

He was married and had two sons living in Chicago. Why he ran to Tennessee is a mystery.
Quite the soap opera.


Steve

machinehead61
August 8th, 2012, 02:08 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s720x720/427536_337875106300748_938559813_n.jpg

This is the entire bankruptcy docket. Took me 2 days spending about 8 hours total to sift through the mass of legal documents to find the history I've posted here. But it answered quite a few questions and raised some more.

Steve

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 04:15 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/182168_339716396116619_2005382393_n.jpg

Paragraph 14 states that Baldwin used its own accountants to audit the G. D. Whitcomb company and intentionally under valued its assets.

Paragraph 16 states that Baldwin placed Lloyd E. Work on the board of directors. Mr. Work represented the owners of $95,000 of bonds that were secured by the company property.

In exchange, Baldwin paid off the bonds early when they weren't due until January 1, 1937.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 04:22 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/2819_339716609449931_1787517250_n.jpg

Paragraph 18 states that Baldwin called for a special meeting of the board of directors on March 5, 1931 to address supposedly routine business matters.

But actually the purpose of the meeting was to get the vote needed to start the bankruptcy. All of this was unknown to William Whitcomb - then President of Whitcomb. The other stock holder, Carl Heim wasn't at the meeting.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 04:29 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/198923_339716766116582_18672224_n.jpg

Paragraph 21 claims that Baldwin at the March 5, 1931 meeting then replaced all of the controlling officers of Whitcomb with Baldwin employees and that all future board of director meetings would be held in Philadelphia at Baldwin's office.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 04:36 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/311910_339718279449764_294469257_n.jpg

Paragraph 23 states that the Whticomb company was not bankrupt. It had paid its interest on its mortgage, it didn't have any creditor filing suit against the company forcing it into bankruptcy.

It claimed that company assets exceeded liabilities by $850,000.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 04:54 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/380394_339718536116405_1636050423_n.jpg

Paragraph 27 is a mystery to me. It states that "alleged" company assets were only $119,568, and that actually they were $657,446,49.

Where the $119,568 number came from I can only guess that it was from the pre-bankruptcy audit performed by the Baldwin accountants. A newspaper article stated that Whitcomb had been audited in February, 1931 prior to the bankruptcy.

Perhaps this number was used to convince Mr. Work that his $95,000 of bonds would never get paid back unless Baldwin took over.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 04:59 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/579920_339718726116386_1506487916_n.jpg

Paragraph 29 has its own question. Stockholders were W. Whitcomb, Baldwin, and Carl Heim.

Heim by this time was in hiding. He couldn't have voted unless by proxi.

Yet the stockholder resolution passed that condemned the board of directors actions.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 05:04 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/208248_339721119449480_1579161498_n.jpg

Paragraph 32 states that Baldwin then created the new "Whitcomb Locomotive Company" on April 7, 1931 incorporated in Delaware.

On April 10th, 1931 the new corporation got a license to operate in Illinois.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 05:10 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/580813_339722326116026_1776868124_n.jpg

Paragraph 36 states that on April 13, 1931 that "Whitcomb Locomotive Company" bought up the "George D. Whitcomb Company".

Baldwin filed a counter petition in the bankruptcy docket to allow the bankruptcy to proceed.

Apparently the court agreed not to stop the proceedings. The conspiracy suit was beyond the scope of the bankruptcy court.

machinehead61
August 13th, 2012, 05:17 PM
From Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitcomb_Locomotive_Works


In 1929 the company was purchased by The Baldwin Locomotive Works (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/Baldwin_Locomotive_Works), and the new owners, under George Houston sought a greater base of diversified holdings.

This article has no citation for this statement and it obviously is in error.

As soon as I have some more information from the Chicago suit, I will edit the Wiki article complete with court case citations.

Steve

machinehead61
August 14th, 2012, 02:59 AM
Today I phoned the Clerks' office of the Circuit Court for Cook County in Chicago and requested the William C. Whitcomb suit against Baldwin Case #34C 1936 filed February 14, 1934. According to the Baldwin response to the W. Whitcomb petition to intervene, that Cook County case was dismissed on May 16, 1935.

http://www.cookcountyclerkofcourt.org/?section=RecArchivePage&RecArchivePage=6000

The Clek's office said it should have it ready by next Monday.

The same Baldwin petition then refers to a later suit filed by W. Whitcomb in Federal court in Philadelphia against Baldwin. I have no date nor case number for that Federal suit.


Will worry about that after the Cook County suit is available and I have searched it.


Steve

BoxcabE50
August 14th, 2012, 03:04 AM
As you noted earlier, "Quite the soap opera".

machinehead61
August 14th, 2012, 03:42 AM
As you noted earlier, "Quite the soap opera".

I had no idea that all of this had happened. I assumed it was a simple matter of a small locomotive builder going bankrupt because of poor business during the Great Depression.

Never, never assume . . .

Steve

BoxcabE50
August 14th, 2012, 03:51 AM
This is certainly all new for me. While I do know things such as this did, (and still do), happen, I had not the slightest hint it was involved here.

machinehead61
August 14th, 2012, 10:53 PM
This is certainly all new for me. While I do know things such as this did, (and still do), happen, I had not the slightest hint it was involved here.

I haven't searched the local newspapers on microfilm to see if they were aware of this suit against Baldwin. This all takes time to go through.

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/562701_340143449407247_1935962403_n.jpg

Paragraph 14 of the Baldwin petition to the bankruptcy court asking the court to ignore the Whitcomb petititon states the date and case number of W. Whitcomb's suit.

machinehead61
August 16th, 2012, 01:42 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/s720x720/183730_340496462705279_747075902_n.jpg

My mistake. The Cook County circuit court REFUSED Baldwin's petition to dismiss the Whitcomb suit on May 13, 1935.

Also, it appears that Baldwin petitioned the Federal court in Pennsylvania to dismiss any suit brought against Baldwin relating to the Whitcomb case.

Steve

machinehead61
August 16th, 2012, 01:55 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/528140_340499369371655_958518886_n.jpg

In paragraph 15, the petititon states that W. Whitcomb is suing Baldwin for the money that his stock was worth when the company was sold.

It appears that W. Whitcomb had no ambitions to regain control of his company.

Steve

machinehead61
August 16th, 2012, 02:15 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s720x720/484630_340503086037950_91637251_n.jpg

In paragraph 20 seen above, Baldwin states that W. Whitcomb filed a claim in the United States District Court in Pennsylvania.


The Cause (case) No. 18519 must be W. Whitcomb's suit in the Pennsylvania Federal court and it must have been filed by February 25, 1935.


I will see if I can request that case.


Steve

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 01:30 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/488185_341829109238681_1969484198_n.jpg

Here are photos I took this evening of the vacant Whitcomb factory - last occupied by PBM precast concrete.

This is from the south west corner of the plant.

Steve

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 01:33 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/427236_341829245905334_982869328_n.jpg

From the southwest corner looking north.

Steve

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 01:38 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/431391_341829429238649_693692719_n.jpg

Like a lot of other industrial ruins around the U.S. this building may be torn down. It is now owned by Behr recyclers and they wish to turn the property into a metal recycling center but the city isn't sure if the building is safe for public use.

http://www.jbehr.com/

Steve

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 01:40 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/581237_341829595905299_416076600_n.jpg

All that is left of the gantry crane that was used to unload steel when locomotives were built here.

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 01:44 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/522027_284270608327865_1888352505_n.jpg

This photo was taken post WW II when Baldwin operated the plant.

Steve

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 02:49 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/297429_341829762571949_1953920253_n.jpg

Another view. If you go to google map and street view you still see the entire crane there. That is dated from fall 2007.

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 02:55 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/378747_342003739221218_978705380_n.jpg

In this view one can see at least 4 large doors that appear to have been bricked in.

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 03:00 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/575095_293156297439296_1918897578_n.jpg

This would appear to be the same part of the building but with a sliding table and pit to move locomotives from diffent bays to the track to exit to the main line.

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 03:04 PM
In the above photo you can see the many different rails on the table to accomodate the various gauges that Whitcomb customers used. These locomitves went all around the world.

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 03:08 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/522617_278533362234923_442760228_n.jpg

An inside view of the bays where the locomitves are in different stages of construction.

BoxcabE50
August 20th, 2012, 03:20 PM
I wonder how many people think of these buildings only as an old nuisance. Knowing nothing of their history?

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 03:42 PM
A phone call to the Cook County Circuit Court Archives and they still have not retrieved the Whitcomb suit. They recommend calling back each day as they receive deliveries daily. One week and counting. Quite a bit slower than the National Archives.

Steve

machinehead61
August 20th, 2012, 03:47 PM
I wonder how many people think of these buildings only as an old nuisance. Knowing nothing of their history?

Last night as I walked around the property with camera and tripod in tow, 3 teenaged kids hanging out in a patch of woods next to the property (they have hand-built a BMX bike track in these woods) asked me what I was doing. I explained I was photographing the building as part of my documentation of the history of the Whitcomb locomotive Company.

They never heard of Whitcomb locomoitves before and had no idea what history building had seen. They didn't know that the two locomotives sitting in the Rochelle train park were built in Rochelle.

After sharing some of the history the kids thanked me - they never knew all of that had happened right next to where they were growing up. They expressed hope that the building would not be torn down. I agreed.

Steve

machinehead61
August 22nd, 2012, 03:34 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/420099_342499545838304_471740624_n.jpg

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/388147_342500405838218_346719200_n.jpg

A productive day today. I contacted the Glendora California Library and a very helpful reference librarian helped me with the year of birth and middle name for William Card Whitcomb. With that info I searched ancestry.com and found this passport application from 1920 along with my first photograph of William C.

Now to find living relatives if possible.

Steve

machinehead61
August 25th, 2012, 05:43 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/577445_284270411661218_157022962_n.jpg

Another photo from inside the Rochelle plant during the construction of what appears to be the Argentine State Railway order.

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/522883_293109257444000_913901688_n.jpg

A builders' photo outside the Rochelle plant.

machinehead61
August 25th, 2012, 05:46 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/564306_305578166197109_1114369335_n.jpg

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/551052_307739432647649_1231394979_n.jpg

A couple of photos showing the locomotives unloading from a ship. In the top photo one can make out the words "Whitcomb Locomotive".

machinehead61
August 26th, 2012, 10:55 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/546263_284289201659339_256841691_n.jpg

This page came from the 1947 Locomotive Cyclopedia.

machinehead61
August 27th, 2012, 08:28 PM
A phone call to the Cook County Circuit Court Archives at first got me "no, it isn't in yet". When I told them I have now waited 2 weeks, they took a second look and discovered the case is in after all. I can't take a camera in. $2.00 for the first copy, $0.50 for the rest. I can bring a scanner - which I don't have. This will be a bit more expensive than the National Archives.

For those that don't know what I'm talking about, I have requested the Whitcomb suit against Baldwin filed in 1934 where William Whitcomb sued Baldwin for the value of his stock that he lost when Baldwin sunk his company into a voluntary bankruptcy.

Steve

paperkite
August 27th, 2012, 09:45 PM
Steve,
You have the makings of a great "made for TV docu drama " that would rival the Wheels from Hell or what ever that series is . Awsome work you have done for history sake. Let us hope your work can set the history correct ? mayhaps? What crooks Baldwin appeard to be .... scheesssshhhh , not the first time something from Cook county IL came up stinking ?

machinehead61
August 28th, 2012, 01:52 AM
Steve,
You have the makings of a great "made for TV docu drama " that would rival the Wheels from Hell or what ever that series is . Awsome work you have done for history sake. Let us hope your work can set the history correct ? mayhaps? What crooks Baldwin appeard to be .... scheesssshhhh , not the first time something from Cook county IL came up stinking ?Thank you. I really stumbled into this project. Every year for the past 7 years Rochelle had its annual Railroad days I never saw anything about the Whitcomb, even though we have two of them sitting in the park.

http://www.rochellerailroadpark.org/rrdays.html

A neighbor of mine has a daughter that's friends with our daughter (adopted) and the Dad is the head of tourism and organizer of the Railroad Days. I asked why nobody ever does a Whitcomb display. He said because nobody has stepped up to do it. I asked if I did one would he want it in the event? He said sure. That was sometime around January of this year. By June I was bitten by the research bug. It's like on a treasure hunt. I never know what or where I'm going to find something. I'm hooked. Waited until I was 50 years old to find my life calling but this historical research is it. I feel like I'm contributing something to society that didn't exist before.

Now to find out what treasures lie in the California State Railroad Museum if only I can find someone out there who can help.

Steve

BoxcabE50
August 28th, 2012, 02:12 AM
I always enjoy seeing the history books set straight. Not from a viewpoint of "correctness", but just the irrefutable via cold hard facts.

machinehead61
August 28th, 2012, 02:35 AM
I always enjoy seeing the history books set straight. Not from a viewpoint of "correctness", but just the irrefutable via cold hard facts.I'm with you 100%. The net is full of unsubstantiated, undocumented crap. I prefere to document every source that I quote. That way other people can go find it also. Here are newspaper articles about the Whitcomb treasurer and his problems:

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s720x720/305013_344578828963709_1948839914_n.jpg

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.278532755568317.71372.100002347842957&type=1

This was from the Rochelle News, Thursday March 19, 1931 front page.

Steve

machinehead61
August 28th, 2012, 02:41 AM
Couldn't fix the second photo above so will post it here:

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/s720x720/205908_344580032296922_1190800370_n.jpg

This was before Heim was found in Tennessee.

Steve

machinehead61
August 28th, 2012, 02:46 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/s720x720/378309_344582022296723_543910375_n.jpg

This is when Carl Heim was caught and sent back to Illinois.

When I get done with the Whitcomb suit my next search will be the criminal case against Heim in Ogle county Illinois. I might try to find what he was arrested for in Tennessee and why he was down there.

A strange note: the original grand jury indictments were declared invalid because WOMEN were on the jury !

Steve

paperkite
August 28th, 2012, 04:40 PM
Steve,
You need to write a book on this. Mix a little ficton in...not much as some of this stuff is pretty strange already . Can't wait to find out about Heim in Tn and for gosh sakes ... women on a grand jury in IL ... sounds like the AG was as funky as a govenor I know of from there ...

machinehead61
August 31st, 2012, 01:12 AM
Steve,
You need to write a book on this. Mix a little ficton in...not much as some of this stuff is pretty strange already . Can't wait to find out about Heim in Tn and for gosh sakes ... women on a grand jury in IL ... sounds like the AG was as funky as a govenor I know of from there ...Not into fiction writing thank you. I like the real world. It has more than enough to keep my interest. As for the State's Attorney being funky, I can't imagine any judge would allow that discrimination to occur unless it was a legal standard back then.

Steve

paperkite
August 31st, 2012, 01:59 PM
If women were on the panel , that would preclued the law allowing women legal status in all things having to do with existing laws ( including grand jury duty ). By 1920 ( 19th amendment was ratified) women had gotten the right to vote . I am not sure I agree with the assumption that IL or any state , had laws that validated women on grand jury's and then had laws that disallowed their findings . These guys got away with fraud, theft, denying civil rights and who knows some one did not end up as fish food.

BoxcabE50
August 31st, 2012, 02:31 PM
I'm certain that after you are done with this, you'll not be interested in pursuing another. But this is starting to have so many convoluted twists and turns, I begin wondering about how other proceedings of other companies or railroads, from that same or earlier era. What kinds of messes were those, behind the scenes? Yikes.

machinehead61
September 1st, 2012, 02:34 PM
If women were on the panel , that would preclued the law allowing women legal status in all things having to do with existing laws ( including grand jury duty ). By 1920 ( 19th amendment was ratified) women had gotten the right to vote . I am not sure I agree with the assumption that IL or any state , had laws that validated women on grand jury's and then had laws that disallowed their findings . These guys got away with fraud, theft, denying civil rights and who knows some one did not end up as fish food.A quick google search and this information story came up:

http://askville.amazon.com/women-allowed-serve-jury/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=14513860


Women's history


At the state level March 7, 1870 in the state of Wyoming granted jury rights to women but latter toke the right away then restored in the 1950’s.
Georgia in a long post WWII state house battle granted women jury rights on December 21, 1953.

ON THE FEDERAL LEVEL:
Other states were challenged in courts by women’s rights groups all the way to the Supreme Court and as late as a 1961 case denied women jury rights because of their "special status" referring back to a previous decision in the 1800’s.
However, in 1975 in the case of Taylor v. Louisiana, the Supreme Court reversed its 1961 position about the 6th amendment rights of criminal defendants, and now holds the exclusion of women from juries is impermissible. Women are a "distinctive group" and "sufficiently numerous and distinct from men" that jury pools without them are a violation of a defendant’s right to be tried before a true cross-section of the community. "If there was ever the case that women were unqualified to sit on juries or were so situated that none of them should be required to perform jury service, that time has long since passed."

I never knew that discrimination against women in juries didn't end until 1975!

Steve

machinehead61
September 1st, 2012, 03:00 PM
I'm certain that after you are done with this, you'll not be interested in pursuing another. But this is starting to have so many convoluted twists and turns, I begin wondering about how other proceedings of other companies or railroads, from that same or earlier era. What kinds of messes were those, behind the scenes? Yikes.Actually, I have ambitions to continue researching and publishing as long as I am alive. I have found almost nothing on George Houston, the President of Baldwin and one of the defendents in the Whitcomb suit. I can't even find what years he was president on the internet. No Wikipedia article on him. No date of birth nor death. Where he was born, educated. Nada. This is the only image I have of George Houston:


http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51PN-kzZwbL._SX450_.jpg


It also appears that Baldwin during this bankruptcy case with Whitcomb - itself went bankrupt!

http://www.fi.edu/learn/case-files/baldwin/breakdown.html


Baldwin managers failed to recognize or adapt to changing circumstances as the age of steam engines waned. They began a diversification program in 1929 just as the Great Depression began. The company was overextended, sales of capital goods evaporated, and Baldwin Locomotive Works filed for bankruptcy in 1935.

Also, a friend has asked me if I knew anything about the Baldwin acquisition of the Milwaukee Locomotive Manufacturing Company:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitcomb_Locomotive_Works


On July 19, 1932 Whitcomb Locomotive Company acquired the Milwaukee Locomotive Manufacturing Company (http://www.trainboard.com/w/index.php?title=Milwaukee_Locomotive_Manufacturing _Company&action=edit&redlink=1).

Again, zero citation for this statement. As part of my Whitcomb research I must also contact the California State Railway Museum to investigate this claim as our Rochelle Museum has no record of this.

From a google search:

http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=32365


To the best of my knowledge a Milwaukee Locomotive Mfg. Co. builder's list does not exist. Their parent company was absorbed by Westinghouse Airbrake Co. Around 1932 WAB sold the loco business to Whitcomb. Whitcomb got some information, and a number of latter day Milwaukee serials in the 800s and 900s appear in WLCo records, but the main body of Milwaukee information remained WAB property and was taken to the home plant at Wilmerding, PA. It was destroyed during a clean-out in the 1950s. A few early catalogs did survive the purge.

Milwaukee serials apparently began at 1. Some early catalog illustrations are clear enough to read single digit serials on some very early locos. The highest known serial is around 985 or so. It is not known if every number between 1 and 985 was actually used.

I might try to contact this person.

No shortage of leads to track down!

Steve

paperkite
September 1st, 2012, 03:32 PM
Steve ,
I stand corrected , 50 years later. amazing .
Paul

machinehead61
September 1st, 2012, 04:30 PM
Steve ,
I stand corrected , 50 years later. amazing .
PaulIndeed, amazing.

Another fact that I overlooked in the Whitcomb suit:

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/523552_346184208803171_1945052339_n.jpg

Paragraph 17 states that Whitcomb and Heim had been negotiating the sale of their stock to Baldwin prior to the bunkruptcy, but no deal had been reached.

Apparently Mr. Houston did want to buy the company and Whitcomb and Heim were interested in selling but didn't like the offer.

So Houston and company pulled the swindle.

Steve

machinehead61
September 4th, 2012, 12:27 AM
Today I recieved a message on Facebook from a Whitcomb descendent who has family history on Gerge D. and William C. including a note that William C. was making payroll out of his own pocket at one point. She also has photos. Exactly what I was hoping for.

Also, I realized that the Whitcomb suit in Pennsylvania Federal Court was a response to Baldwins' filing bankruptcy in that court in 1935. I suspect that Baldwin was attempting to put an injunction against Whitcombs suit as part of the bankruptcy protection.

Steve

machinehead61
September 4th, 2012, 04:07 AM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/551222_298095820278677_666764004_n.jpg

I have a partial list of the employees in this photo circa about 1920.

Steve

paperkite
September 4th, 2012, 04:42 PM
Yep, that would have made the bull dog chew his chain , especally if Whitcomb felt they (Whitcomb et al ) were beneath his stature. the revenge would have been on and the scheme to take Whitcomb et al . was launched . with Whitcomb having limited resources ( none at this point or not enough ) to fight the scheme , they ( Whitcomb ) lost . Good work Steve. I still think you have the makings of a first class docudrama ... This is way better than the Hell on Wheels nonsense...
Paul

machinehead61
September 5th, 2012, 10:04 AM
Yep, that would have made the bull dog chew his chain , especally if Whitcomb felt they (Whitcomb et al ) were beneath his stature. the revenge would have been on and the scheme to take Whitcomb et al . was launched . with Whitcomb having limited resources ( none at this point or not enough ) to fight the scheme , they ( Whitcomb ) lost . Good work Steve. I still think you have the makings of a first class docudrama ... This is way better than the Hell on Wheels nonsense...
PaulApparently Baldwin wasn't in the best financial shape either.

I suspect that William C. was fighting for his retirement money that was lost in the form of his Whitcomb stock. He was born October 3, 1868 and by 1931 when this bankruptcy wiped out his stock he was 62 years old. No Social Security back then to support a retired person. His family was use to a life of privelege that included at least 2 long European vacations. In his wife's passport application (April 1920) she wrote that they would be touring France, Switzerland, Italy, Belgium, Holland for about 18 months - "educational purposes". During that time their girls (ages 12 and 10) would have to be tutored. Very expensive education paid for by profits from the company.

Steve

machinehead61
September 8th, 2012, 05:50 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s720x720/558187_332789463475979_1936033834_n.jpg

This photo comes from Hawaii and a friend who is a member of this group:

http://www.hawaiianrailway.com/

During WW II Whitcomb locomotives were used to supply Pearl Harbor with munitions. The United States Naval Ammunition Depot ( USNAD ) was built away from Honolulu on the other side of a mountain to protect the city from possible explosions from an attack on the depot and thus used a railway to move the munitions around to the other side to where Pearl Harbor and the Pacific fleet were stationed.

Steve

machinehead61
September 8th, 2012, 05:57 PM
Here is an interesting link:

http://ambard.com/update/History-of-NAD.pdf

machinehead61
September 15th, 2012, 11:41 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/557241_332789220142670_2053920134_n.jpg

Another Whitcomb locomotive from Hawaii.

BoxcabE50
September 16th, 2012, 12:45 AM
All taped up due to be shipped somewhere?

machinehead61
September 17th, 2012, 02:54 AM
All taped up due to be shipped somewhere?
Prepped before Navy paint job I suspect. Not sure why the Navy would repaint them after they had the factory paint job. I have many builders photos showing company names painted on the locomotives from the factory.

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/s720x720/168885_317872974967628_1253624432_n.jpg

This loco is ready to be shipped with its factory paint job on. That is the Rochelle plant in the background.

Steve

paperkite
September 17th, 2012, 08:59 PM
Steve,
Thanks for posting the links about NAD, wonder how much the McCandless family got for their 8100 acre cattle ranch/paradise ....course they most likely owned half the island anyway ...

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 12:46 AM
Steve,
Thanks for posting the links about NAD, wonder how much the McCandless family got for their 8100 acre cattle ranch/paradise ....course they most likely owned half the island anyway ...You're welcome. I'm in debt to the fine gentleman working at the museum there who supplied me with the Hawaiian photos.

I went into Chicago today to look at the Whitcomb v. Baldwin suit. Appropriately I took the METRA in :)

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s320x320/546412_352404298181162_1854299979_n.jpg

The Daley Center and the Chicago Circuit Court Archives - my destination.

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/530068_352404714847787_632780031_n.jpg

The Ogilvie Transportation Center - end of the line for the METRA downtown Chicago. 5 block walk to the Daley Center.

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/558556_352407238180868_762522456_n.jpg

Destination - 11th floor and the archives.

Yes, the Chicago teachers are still on strike :)

Steve

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 05:10 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s320x320/36325_352631391491786_1925624566_n.jpg

In the Whitcomb suit against Baldwin for loss of value of all Whitcomb stock due to the company voluntarily filing for bankruptcy, the first defense Baldwin tried was claiming that the Chicago Circuit Court had no jurisdiction over any matters because they claimed that the Federal Bankruptcy Court had all jurisdiction. The Chicago judge denied that claim. Next, Baldwin claimed the Chicago Circuit Court had no jurisdiction over Baldwin because Baldwin claimed they did no business in Illinois.

Steve

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 05:12 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/547998_352633388158253_685473206_n.jpg

The Chicago judge threw that Baldwin defense out the window. Baldwin had sales reps in Chicago since 1910 and charged phone bills, office supplies, etc. all to Baldwin for the Chicago office. The year of this defense, Baldwin sold about $1,000,000 worth of locomotives in Illinois. Judge Stanley Klarkowski threw out the Baldwin petition to dismiss and gave them 20 days to respond to Whitcomb's charges of conspiracy to defraud.

Steve

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 05:19 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/74807_352636721491253_1646456570_n.jpg"

Finally on May 25, 1937 judge Klarkowski dismissed the case "with prejudice and without costs to either party". If they settled out of court - I have no record of it.

The details of Baldwins' defense brings to light some Whitcomb history that did not appear in the bankruptcy case and that William C. Whitcomb failed to mention in his suit.

There are two sides to every story. I suspect that some of William's claims were true, but he had no way of proving it. His word against Baldwins. Heresay without witnesses.


Steve

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 05:49 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/271145_352644318157160_9192106_n.jpg

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/480445_352644454823813_162922935_n.jpg

In these two pages, Baldwin shows how the Whitcomb Company was in financial trouble - how the Central Trust Company of Illinois was threatening and in fact, did seize the Whitcomb account at their business valued at $41,000 on March 5, 1931. This was the day that the voluntary bankruptcy was filed.

Steve

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 06:04 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/581464_352651434823115_408426501_n.jpg

This and the following 2 pages give background history of the Whitcomb Company not known to me before.

Very happy to find this.

Steve

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 06:11 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/564320_352652358156356_1458100089_n.jpg

Paragraph 2 is very important and I believe it to be true. William C. Whitcomb did allow Carl Heim to basically take over the financial operation of the company. This turned out to be a huge mistake.

Paragraph 3 answers some other questions I had.. I didn't know how or when Baldwin came into the picture before this document.


Stevce

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 06:18 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/539417_352653818156210_274445513_n.jpg

Paragraph 4 accuses both Heim and Whitcomb of illegally issuing themselves "old common capital stock".

Paragraph 5 states the total amount that Baldwin was invested into the Whitcomb Company for was $537,500. THAT IS A CHUNCK OF CHANGE FOR 1928.

I read in this case that George Houston didn't become president of Baldwin until 1929 - so this means that Baldwin's initial interest into Whitcomb was started before Houston came to power.

Steve

machinehead61
September 18th, 2012, 06:31 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/561113_352656564822602_333150634_n.jpg

The last paragraph on this page shows how bad business was for Whitcomb.

1931 - lost $64,383.09
1932 - lost $128,501.07
1933- lost $69,090.03
1934 - lost $45,068.41

Total operating losses from 1931-1934 = $307,043.19

Then add the $537,500 initial investment and the $257,000 they paid in the bankruptcy to buy the company and you get . . .

$1,101,043.19

Baldwin had sunk over $1.1 million into a losing company by 1934.

1935 Baldwin declared bankruptcy.

Steve

paperkite
September 18th, 2012, 06:36 PM
How fitting to take the METRA to research another road... great follow up .... and I bet the ride was pretty cool ... Great work following the trail ....

machinehead61
September 19th, 2012, 01:15 AM
How fitting to take the METRA to research another road... great follow up .... and I bet the ride was pretty cool ... Great work following the trail ....Thanks paperkite.

I forgot to add the $125,000 promisory note to the money sink hole called Whitcomb.

Total Baldwin sunk into the unprofitable Whitcomb Company through 1934 was $1,226,043.19 - give or take a penny :startled:

Over $1.2 million and no profit. The Great Depression was not kind to locomotive builders.

Steve

machinehead61
September 20th, 2012, 11:28 PM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/561565_353419254746333_13324771_n.jpg

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/298370_353419351412990_736970303_n.jpg

This is an internal memo from the Chicago office of Baldwin to the home office alerting them that W. C. Whitcomb has dicovered that Mr. Heim has been stealing from the company. For months Heim had been delaying a Baldwin audit of the Whitcomb finances and for very good reason. Mr. Whitcomb and family had been gone on yet another European trip while the Fox was left guarding the hen house.

Another side note is that by this time a Mr. Guest had been the office manager of Whitcomb and had suspected that someone was stealing from the company. He was fired by this time - most likely by Mr. Heim.

Steve

paperkite
September 20th, 2012, 11:41 PM
Good grief , no wonder Baldwin filed ... nice work Steve , Mr Heim looks to be the scoundrel indeed . He, Mr. Heim , must have been pretty smooth talker to have gotten that far ( four years ) that's assuming he is the one responsible for the losses .

machinehead61
September 20th, 2012, 11:55 PM
Good grief , no wonder Baldwin filed ... nice work Steve , Mr Heim looks to be the scoundrel indeed . He, Mr. Heim , must have been pretty smooth talker to have gotten that far ( four years ) that's assuming he is the one responsible for the losses .Note that on the first page in the second paragraph it states that Whitcomb had phoned Heim in Knoxville (he wasn't sure). Later, Heim was arrested in Tennesssee according to the Rochelle newspaper story. What and why Heim was down there I don't have a clue. My next search will be the Ogle County court house and the arrest/extradiction order for Carl Heim. I hope that the police photographed him when he was processed and posted bond. That will be my first photo of the infamous Mr. Heim. I hope to find the criminal prosecution case for Heim.

Curious enough, by the 1940 census, Mr. Heim is listed at his same Chicago address as the filing member for the census. He listed his occupation as a vice president of a company!!! 4 years of college education. I hope to find out more on Heim and his background.

Steve

machinehead61
September 22nd, 2012, 02:46 PM
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/s720x720/541306_353964151358510_1811517189_n.jpg

This add printed in January 1944 in a Rochelle newspaper shows that by then Whitcomb had been unionized. I have no idea when.

http://www.fi.edu/learn/case-files/baldwin/breakdown.html


In 1910, the good relations between management and workers broke down. Police reaction to a strike by Philadelphia transportation workers ballooned into a confrontation with Baldwin workers and eventually into a general strike by workers across the city. Union organizing was set in motion at Baldwin Locomotive Works, resulting in establishment of thirteen separate, but cooperating, craft unions. No lasting agreement was reached between the unions and the managers on matters of overtime wages, rehiring procedures, and working conditions, and a strike was called in June of 1911. The strike lasted a few weeks before breaking down and operations at Baldwin resumed on a less cordial basis.

It appears that Baldwin had been unionized early and when they gained contol over Whitcomb I wonder if the union was instituted in Whitcomb as part of the Baldwin/union contract? But would that have to wait until after the bankruptcy was finally discharged in 1938?

Steve

machinehead61
September 22nd, 2012, 08:42 PM
http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/36577_354065474681711_645934692_a.jpg

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/375784_354065641348361_1804911364_n.jpg

From the Rochelle News, Thursday January 21, 1932 comes this story that is following the criminal case against Carl Heim.

Monday I'm contacting the Ogle County Court archives and see if I can request this case.

Steve

machinehead61
September 24th, 2012, 04:02 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/527327_354528097968782_1783279926_n.jpg

Just found this add from 1950 on the net.

Steve

machinehead61
October 2nd, 2012, 01:30 AM
A very productive day. I have located a grandson of William Card Whitcomb. He has informed me that one of W.C. Whitcombs' daughters married into the Harvey family of Harvey Girls fame:

http://www.movieposterdb.com/posters/12_08/1946/38589/l_38589_b6de2ead.jpg

The grandson and his cousin both live in the Greater Chicagoland area. I plan on getting together with them in a couple of weeks and swapping notes.

Steve

machinehead61
October 10th, 2012, 12:28 AM
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/156398_281238101964449_1672096335_n.jpg

In 1929, Whitcomb laid claim to building the largest gasoline locomotive in the world - 100 tons. This photo came from the Rochelle museum and I believe it is of that 100 ton gas locomotive.

Steve

BoxcabE50
October 10th, 2012, 12:36 AM
That one does look quite chunky. The ladder and walkway are certainly unusual.

machinehead61
November 5th, 2012, 02:44 AM
That one does look quite chunky. The ladder and walkway are certainly unusual.Pretty darn ugly.


http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/12849_370942156327376_1706901129_n.jpg

The Rochelle News, Thursday January 28, 1932

I find it hard to believe that Mr. Heim wasn't convicted, but he still faced another charge.

I've been playing catch-up around the house and research hasn't seen much time.

Steve

machinehead61
November 12th, 2012, 05:26 AM
Today I stumbled across this find given to me by a man whose father worked at Whitcomb. Baldwin magazine Third and Fourth Quarters 1949.

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/578947_373600589394866_1606982222_n.jpg

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/197117_373600902728168_1478243449_n.jpg

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/15161_373601339394791_2063863943_n.jpg

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/534552_373601456061446_1604253763_n.jpg

A great find.

If anyone wants, I can scan the entire 32 pages.

Steve

machinehead61
November 20th, 2012, 11:20 PM
I finally got around to editing the Wikipedia article on Whitcomb:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitcomb_Locomotive_Works

I'll add some more later. Now I have a comprehensive history to write by next June and the annual Rochelle Railroad Days. Some people said they will buy a copy if I write it.

Steve

BoxcabE50
November 20th, 2012, 11:52 PM
Quite a job you have done. I never had a clue there was so much to know on this subject.

Also, looking at the second picture in post 117, you can easily see why many folks are attracted to modeling in scales such as On30, HOn30, etc. Those little critters are sure neat!

machinehead61
November 23rd, 2012, 01:22 PM
Quite a job you have done. I never had a clue there was so much to know on this subject.

When I started, I had no idea either.


Also, looking at the second picture in post 117, you can easily see why many folks are attracted to modeling in scales such as On30, HOn30, etc. Those little critters are sure neat!I think that a very large volume of these smaller builders has gone unnoticed by the modeling community. I eventually would like to build a large scale model of the very first Whitcomb IC mine locomotive if drawings/photos are available.

If none available, a large scale model of their WW II 65 ton military locomotives sent to Europe. These had armor plate and I've never seen a model of one built.

Our local gift shop has a builder's photo of one of these armor plate locos.


Steve

machinehead61
April 7th, 2013, 05:20 PM
Been gone for a while posting history on another train website that is dedicated to RR preservation:

http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33922

I've been researching the WW II activities of Whitcomb and have come across some never-before-published photographs:

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/p206x206/314582_391268360961422_2091703885_n.jpg


https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/314582_391268360961422_2091703885_n.jpg

A member of the other forum had been helping to restore a 65-ton Whitcomb centercab ex-U.S. Army locomotive when visited by a WW II veteran of the Military Railway Service (MRS) who had operated these during the war over in the European Theater of Operations (ETO). This one had been destroyed and it appears that the cylinder head had been removed. These locomotives were running Buda diesel engines that quickly earned a reputation for cracking cylinder heads.

This is from "The Yankee Boomer" a newsletter of the MRS in the ETO printed during the war:

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/418869_429594750462116_249502122_n.jpg

Note the need for Buda cylinder heads:

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/313401_429595013795423_204210016_n.jpg

I can share more WW II photos later.

Steve

machinehead61
April 7th, 2013, 05:46 PM
I might add that I have been doing further editing of the Wiki article for Whitcomb and adding citations of source material:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitcomb_Locomotive_Works

Also, I will be doing my second Whitcomb display at the Rochelle Railroad Days:

http://www.rochellerailroadpark.org/rrdays.html

Last year we had about 2,500 - 3,000 visitors.

Come on out and say hi !

Steve

paperkite
April 7th, 2013, 05:50 PM
Nice update Steve, I still think a book by you is in order ! It would make a great " made for TV " docu drama !!!
Paul

BoxcabE50
April 7th, 2013, 06:08 PM
That destroyed engine must have been through quite a nasty accident.

machinehead61
April 10th, 2013, 03:04 AM
Nice update Steve, I still think a book by you is in order ! It would make a great " made for TV " docu drama !!!
PaulI have started writing the book. I tried to get some funding from our museum but they are pretty tight on cash so until cash comes along the book is a work in progress. I still desperately need to get to California and the Whitcomb/Baldwin archives in Sacremento.

Steve

machinehead61
April 10th, 2013, 03:17 AM
That destroyed engine must have been through quite a nasty accident.You're not kidding. This is what I know of the photo posted by the person who sent it to me:


Here's a scan of a slide of a photo one guy gave to me showing a Whitcomb after an "incident" on the road. If you look closely, it appears the heads are already removed from the engine. The cab looks rather beat up too. I believe the photo was taken in Italy, IIRC.

And other information that he suplied:


From my experience, the 65-ton Military centercab is a rather interesting beast. They had two (2) Buda DCS-1879 engines for a "rating" of 650hp and were MU-capable. The engines were found to be of poor design, mostly due to insufficient coolant flow through the heads, leading to head cracking. They employed the "Lanova" principle for combustion, complete with a separate energy cell. Due to the size of the engines and the generators, 2 banks of batteries, each being 32-volts, were needed to operate the starting winding and start the engines. The contactor arrangement is somewhat unique in the starting/charging circuit. Rated top speed of 46 mph, I was told they were run in multiple on coal trains in Germany during the war, not so much for the horsepower but to ensure the train made the terminal due to probable engine failure.

The story of the multiple unit coal trains came from a guy who was in the USATC and stationed there in WWII. After the 602 arrived and we were working on it, several people showed up who had been in military service during WWII and told us some stories. A few wrote letters of their tour of duty and one guy had some photos he shared with me. The story was that they would MU 3 of the 65-tonners together as they were certain at least one would fail enroute. Once, after we had the 602 up and running well, we figured out why the Germans surrendered with 3 of these things bearing down on them at full-bore! Those Buda's make a lot of noise. And to start one is much more than just closing the battery switch and pushing a button.

Steve

machinehead61
April 10th, 2013, 03:21 AM
By the way, is there a process to make a custom avatar in this forum? I've done it in the other forum but haven't seen a way to do it here.

Steve

BoxcabE50
April 10th, 2013, 03:38 AM
By the way, is there a process to make a custom avatar in this forum? I've done it in the other forum but haven't seen a way to do it here.

Steve

What we do are custom avatars as a thank you for folks who become Supporters. We have a Staff person who can do art, if such is needed.

machinehead61
April 11th, 2013, 12:51 AM
What we do are custom avatars as a thank you for folks who become Supporters. We have a Staff person who can do art, if such is needed.Since I'm currently not a supporter and I'm not particular to any railroad my desire for a Whitcomb avatar is not possible? This one that I created for the other forum is 80x80 - pretty small:

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/733952_442633772491547_412176089_n.jpg

It's a trivial matter so if it can't be done it's no big deal.

Steve

machinehead61
April 11th, 2013, 12:55 AM
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/601601_424831207605137_1237938549_n.jpg


http://www.griffincunningham.net/Griffin/MAIN/743rdphotos2.htm


From the 743rd Railway Operating Battalion in WW II


"One of our diesels and a bunch of our fellows. The engines are now painted black. A couple of them were on a ship then was abandoned then floated again. At sea five months and full of salt when we got them but we put them in running order."

These USATC soldiers are sitting on a Whitcomb 65-ton centercab. I believe somewhere in Germany as other photos from where this one came from refers to German locations.

BTW, I finally got a response from the London War Museum through my local librarian. Been searching for the 561 Whitcomb diesels that were stockpiled in England just prior to D-Day. Haven't found a photo of them though I have found a photo of Baldwin steam locomotives stockpiled in England. Over 1,000 were waiting for the Break-through and landing them on the beaches. A unique technical challenge that I shall post here.

Steve

machinehead61
April 13th, 2013, 03:35 PM
A HUGE THANK YOU to Paperkite and another TB member for these fantastic drawings from the MRS.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/563092_444500298971561_893193675_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/531818_444500475638210_307955206_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/482658_444500678971523_1689485257_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/11849_444501348971456_153304230_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/526477_444501542304770_815365903_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/531776_444501728971418_2029211683_n.jpg

These will be a fantastic addition to the Whitcomb display at our museum and the Railfair Days.

I am in great debt to train forums and their members in helping me with this research. I couldn't do it without you guys.

THANK YOU TRAIN BOARD FORUM !

Steve

machinehead61
April 13th, 2013, 03:44 PM
Also a very alert member at RPN spotted this video and the only Whitcomb film footage that I know of from WW II:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYxgqHsoBak

If you go to the 23 min. 15 sec. mark there is footage taken from a moving train of war damage which I suspect is in Germany and the locomotive pulling the train is a Whitcomb 65-ton centercab.

Steve

BoxcabE50
April 13th, 2013, 03:58 PM
A HUGE THANK YOU to Paperkite and another TB member for these fantastic drawings from the MRS.

Wow. What a great find!

BoxcabE50
April 13th, 2013, 04:12 PM
Also a very alert member at RPN spotted this video and the only Whitcomb film footage that I know of from WW II:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYxgqHsoBak

If you go to the 23 min. 15 sec. mark there is footage taken from a moving train of war damage which I suspect is in Germany and the locomotive pulling the train is a Whitcomb 65-ton centercab.

Steve

The footage preceeding that Whitcomb clip is fascinating. It shows just how much we have lost. More than just the railroads, but a way of life, such as close knit family and camaraderie. :(

machinehead61
April 13th, 2013, 04:19 PM
The footage preceeding that Whitcomb clip is fascinating. It shows just how much we have lost. More than just the railroads, but a way of life, such as close knit family and camaraderie. :(You said a mouthful there Boxcab. I couldn't agree with you more. So sad what has become of us.

Steve

paperkite
April 13th, 2013, 04:21 PM
Also a very alert member at RPN spotted this video and the only Whitcomb film footage that I know of from WW II:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYxgqHsoBak

If you go to the 23 min. 15 sec. mark there is footage taken from a moving train of war damage which I suspect is in Germany and the locomotive pulling the train is a Whitcomb 65-ton centercab.


Steve


Steve , If you go to 29.42 and 29.45 sec there is a shot of eng# 8001 Whitcomb pulling short consist..............

machinehead61
April 13th, 2013, 04:28 PM
Steve , If you go to 29.42 and 29.45 sec there is a shot of eng# 8001 Whitcomb pulling short consist..............I believe that is an Alco unit. The MRS did have drawings of other diesels including GE and Alco. I'll post those and you can judge for yourself.

Steve

machinehead61
April 13th, 2013, 04:38 PM
I just won this on ebay and it arrived Thursday - from China! It was most likely published in the Spring of 1945 as it has merits dated January 1, 1945 but states that no units had entered Germany yet. No digitized copy is on the net so I can post here and make it available. Fascinating history.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/552797_444536208967970_1282424025_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/155655_444536348967956_1898643900_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/67899_444536555634602_48565729_n.jpg

The photo on page 18 with the caption "Crew of the first train into Rome July 4, 1944" - I'm quite confident is a Whitcomb 65-ton centercab. No GE nor Alco diesels used by the MRS had front railings and walkways.

Also note the photographs of the German "Big Hook" and "its dirty work". These are the only photographs that I have found of this.

Steve

machinehead61
April 15th, 2013, 01:12 AM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/533445_305423129545946_990306756_n.jpg

In the above photo are a pair of 65-ton Whitcombs.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/299633_400324716722453_1929827244_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/75020_400324980055760_1592534027_n.jpg

The above photo and caption came from an ebay dealer. I missed the auction but he was kind enough to scan it and the backside caption and email it to me. The small locomotives behind the Whitcomb are captured German diesels.

The German engine is this model:

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/kits/hb/kit_hb_82913.shtml

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/kits/hb/images/hb_82913_title.jpg

The "S.C." behind T/Sgt Robert C. Dunn I believe stands for Signal Corps.

I can't tell the difference between the 65-ton and 72-ton models and the "1228" number doesn't correlate to the USATC numbers of the drawings.

Steve

BoxcabE50
April 15th, 2013, 01:35 AM
I believe you are correct about "S.C."

machinehead61
April 15th, 2013, 01:49 AM
I previously said that I would post details about how the Allies had approached the complications of unloading hundreds of locomotives and rail cars onto beaches since they had not captured any ports shortly after D-Day.

From Popular Science February 1945

http://books.google.com/books?id=AyEDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA78&lpg=PA78&dq=760th+diesel&source=bl&ots=TEBytC_q7S&sig=5fl7wYTmvc0nV4iJWjN33lKXvXc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=GNTtUNvUGYGLqwH1iYGQBQ&sqi=2&ved=0CFYQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=760th%20diesel&f=false


https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/377663_419971784757746_1342762101_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/61732_419968834758041_1753273171_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/72959_419974114757513_355828962_n.jpg

Quite the engineering accomplishment.

Steve

machinehead61
April 15th, 2013, 02:01 AM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/526949_431387473616177_1546556234_n.jpg

This photo is of an amor plate Whitcomb that hangs in the gift shop at the Rochelle Railroad park. I will get a glare-free photo later on.

The MRS drawings show that they carried about 3 tons of armor.

Steve

machinehead61
April 22nd, 2013, 05:48 PM
In my search for Whitcomb history I came across this book:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/483390_435447983210126_941064778_n.jpg

And some reference to Whitcomb:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/300140_435448116543446_302251940_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/559217_435448276543430_2111698074_n.jpg


The first cited source I checked was in error:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/300103_439426789478912_952522883_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/156501_439362282818696_1339553611_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/483808_439418449479746_1212139607_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/164609_439418609479730_1522483135_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/528331_439418822813042_339037648_n.jpg

As you can see there is absolutely nothing on pages 5-8 about Whitcomb. In fact the only reference to Whitcomb in the entire magazine is an add in the back.

As I research this I have gotten to the point where I believe nothing until I see it myself.


Too many false statements and errors.


Steve

machinehead61
April 22nd, 2013, 06:12 PM
Another Churella cited source did prove accurate:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/935450_448815038540087_893563992_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/552772_448797675208490_456224178_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/27153_448797851875139_1463473639_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/15103_448797998541791_9362209_n.jpg

This gives me some previous background on where H. V. Huleguard came from and when he took over Whitcomb operations. He ran the plant thoughout WW II.

This also agrees with the old time engineer and his account:



"Eckert made his home in Rochelle from 1907 to 1932, but for an interval of one and a half years that he was located in Milwaukee. In '32 the Baldwin company, which had taken over the interests in the Whitcomb, transferred Eckert to Philadelphia, but in 1939 he was returned here as chief engineer."

Rochelle Knows Him Well As Engineer, Inventor and Its Own Portrait Painter
Wm. F. Eckert Looks Back On Unusual Career
The Rochelle Leader, January 12, 1943

Steve 3241

BoxcabE50
April 22nd, 2013, 06:18 PM
As I research this I have gotten to the point where I believe nothing until I see it myself.


Too many false statements and errors.

A really good way to do it. I have seen far too many books, magazines, etc, which lazy authors, self-proclaimed scholars and researchers, do exactly what you are avoiding. Then false information keeps getting spread farther and farther, which along with unmerited reputations of those writers it is being accepted as gospel, only does us all harm.

machinehead61
April 22nd, 2013, 07:18 PM
A really good way to do it. I have seen far too many books, magazines, etc, which lazy authors, self-proclaimed scholars and researchers, do exactly what you are avoiding. Then false information keeps getting spread farther and farther, which along with unmerited reputations of those writers it is being accepted as gospel, only does us all harm.I knew this information was contradicting what I was finding in the court cases and neither Whitcomb nor Baldwin challenged it in those courts.

Another one I found:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/537237_399286573492934_1259561782_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/431870_448833775204880_1658955288_n.jpg

Which looks a whole lot like this:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/552911_448835965204661_2021659805_n.jpg

Pinkepank has absolutely no reference for this information and Churella has cited two Baldwin Magazines - both of which pre-date the supposed buy-back of this 8% outstanding stock.

Pinkepanks claim that Whitcomb came out of bankruptcy named "THE WHITCOMB LOCOMOTIVE WORKS" has been repeated all over the net including the Wiki article that used that as its article name. Baldwin never called it "WORKS".
I have yet to find where this came from.

Steve

machinehead61
April 22nd, 2013, 07:39 PM
The other Churella cited source from 1934 is here:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/32412_448841235204134_1168379073_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/936518_448798115208446_1754539052_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/400655_448798268541764_884746383_n.jpg

As you can read on page 23 the magazine clearly states that " . . .The Whitcomb Locomotive Company, which became a part of the Baldwin group in 1931 . . ."


Steve

machinehead61
April 29th, 2013, 02:45 AM
From Baldwin Locomotives magazine February 1940.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/315456_451446811610243_1072499034_n.jpg

I wonder if any of these have survived.

If you wish to see the rest of the magazine . . . .

http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=34806

Steve

machinehead61
May 4th, 2013, 05:28 AM
I'm very thrilled with finding this photo from the 763rd Railway Operating Battalion of a Whitcomb 65-ton Diesel Electric unloading on a beach in France during WW II - guessing post D-Day Fall 1944.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/21760100/763rd-Railway-Operating-Battalion-History

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/s480x480/947100_453594054728852_566154372_n.jpg


Steve

BoxcabE50
May 4th, 2013, 09:44 PM
I know this is sliding off topic a bit, but I would be curious to learn a little more about that ferry. I will guess that it being Royal Navy, she did not last long after WWII?

machinehead61
May 5th, 2013, 01:30 AM
I know this is sliding off topic a bit, but I would be curious to learn a little more about that ferry. I will guess that it being Royal Navy, she did not last long after WWII?I wondered the exact same thing:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Twickenham_Ferry


By November 1944, Twickenham Ferry was employed in taking locomotives (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/Locomotives) to Calais (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/Calais) being able to carry 16 locomotives and 16 wagons. She could also carry an ambulance train of 14 carriages and four wagons., with the associated personnel.

And some background on Calais, France where the H.M.S. Twickenham was unloading locomotives (Whitcombs possibly) if the Wiki article is correct:


During the ensuing German occupation, it became the command post for German forces in the Pas-de-Calais/Flanders region and was very heavily fortified, as it was generally believed by the Germans that the Allies would invade at that point.[38] (http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/#cite_note-Rider2005-38) It was also used as a launch site for V1 flying bombs (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/V1_flying_bomb) and for much of the war, the Germans used the region as the site for railway guns (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/Railway_gun) used to bombard the south-eastern corner of England. In 1943 they built massive bunkers along the coast in preparation for launching missiles on the southeast of England.[39] (http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/#cite_note-KirschFlint2011-39) Despite heavy preparations for defence against an amphibious assault, the Allied invasion took place well to the west in Normandy (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/Normandy) on D-Day (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/D-Day). Calais was very heavily bombed and shelled in a successful effort to disrupt German communications and persuade them that the Allies would target the Pas-de-Calais for invasion (rather than Normandy). The town, by then largely in ruins, was liberated by General Daniel Spry (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/Daniel_Spry)'s 3rd Canadian Infantry Division (http://www.trainboard.com/wiki/3rd_Canadian_Infantry_Division) between 25 September and 1 October 1944.


Steve

BoxcabE50
May 5th, 2013, 02:08 AM
...if the Wiki article is correct:

Yes. Sad, but true.

I was just looking at a map of the Oregon Trail + Bozeman Trail on Wikipedia. Dunno who drew it up, but it shows such as "The Fetterman Massaker". Oh really? What happened to "massacre?" And then up at Fort Benton, Montana, on the Missouri River, another stream flowing on the south of that Fort as being the "Flathead River". The three forks of the Flathead are west of the Rockies, and flow westward into what becomes the Columbia River system. The other river by Fort Benton is the Teton River and it's tributaries.

UGH.

machinehead61
May 6th, 2013, 02:18 PM
I was just looking at a map of the Oregon Trail + Bozeman Trail on Wikipedia. Dunno who drew it up, but it shows such as "The Fetterman Massaker". Oh really? What happened to "massacre?" And then up at Fort Benton, Montana, on the Missouri River, another stream flowing on the south of that Fort as being the "Flathead River". The three forks of the Flathead are west of the Rockies, and flow westward into what becomes the Columbia River system. The other river by Fort Benton is the Teton River and it's tributaries.

UGH.
"Massaker"!

People have gone from being too lazy to reach for a dictionary to being too lazy to reach for the spell check button.:crying:

And geography - too lazy to google search a map?

I worry about the future of this nation.

Steve

Stourbridge Lion
May 6th, 2013, 04:24 PM
In German:

Massaker ist der umgangssprachliche Ausdruck für einen Massenmord unter besonders grausamen Umständen, ein Gemetzel oder Blutbad, häufig im Zusammenhang mit Motiven wie Hass oder Rache. Das Wort leitet sich vom altfranzösischen maçacre, „Schlachthaus“, her.

Translates into English:

Massacre is the colloquial term for a mass murder under particularly cruel circumstances, a slaughter or carnage, often in connection with motifs such as hatred or revenge. The word derives from the Old French maçacre, "slaughterhouse", here.

BoxcabE50
May 6th, 2013, 04:33 PM
Yes. But the map was compiled in all English. For which use of massaker would only be a glaring error.

Stourbridge Lion
May 6th, 2013, 07:17 PM
Being of German decent myself, it was not uncommon for German words to be used as English at home and given American English is a mix-mash of languages what is truly right ;)

Take a look at this German Map; it looks English but it's of German origin and thus "Fetterman Massaker" is the correct usage on that map...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/67/Bozeman01.png

machinehead61
May 17th, 2013, 02:17 AM
Speaking of maps - this is the centerfold from the WW II booklet published by the MRS in early 1945, "American Rails in Eight Countries".

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/971579_459039500850974_2133611855_n.jpg

It must have been drawn before the Allies entered Germany.

Steve

machinehead61
May 20th, 2013, 02:37 PM
Just found these last night:

http://militaryrailwayservice.blogspot.com/2013/04/733rd-railway-operating-battalion.html

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Tyrueimyhe8/UWYktzUQyAI/AAAAAAAAQjg/d0HUTfeKUOY/w522-h530-no/DSCN1540.JPG

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-fhd4pbpsAuw/UWYkvytStmI/AAAAAAAAWb4/UtbvaUACRgk/w583-h530-no/DSCN1541.JPG

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Sp3zVVQ9NVA/UWYkxQUwLiI/AAAAAAAAQjw/XdqeQhQohCE/w310-h530-no/DSCN1542.JPG

These are photos of a Whitcomb 65-ton Diesel Locomotive in ETO during WW II.

Steve

BoxcabE50
May 20th, 2013, 03:25 PM
Stumbled upon this site quite by accident. There are some poor views of diesels.

http://www.paperlessarchives.com/FreeTitles/Historyofthe718thRailwayOperatingBattalion.pdf

paperkite
May 20th, 2013, 03:55 PM
Ken, thanks for listing the site ! The written history of the Battalion is just as valuable as the photos and maybe even more to the WWII buff ! As once again it shows the spirit, forbarence and determination of US military men and women in a call to support direct combat action in ETO against the Axis powers . Little did the Axis know they were up against the greatest fighting force in the world ... something the Japanesse were learning the hard way ... Never kick a sleeping dog !

May God bless our country !!

BoxcabE50
May 20th, 2013, 04:32 PM
Might find a few more diesel photos: http://griffincunningham.net/Griffin/MAIN/robstuff.htm#World_War_II_Units

machinehead61
May 22nd, 2013, 10:53 PM
Might find a few more diesel photos: http://griffincunningham.net/Griffin/MAIN/robstuff.htm#World_War_II_Units My adobe pdf reader isn't working for some reason unknown to me. I can't open it up.

Steve

machinehead61
May 22nd, 2013, 11:00 PM
Ken, thanks for listing the site ! The written history of the Battalion is just as valuable as the photos and maybe even more to the WWII buff ! As once again it shows the spirit, forbarence and determination of US military men and women in a call to support direct combat action in ETO against the Axis powers . Little did the Axis know they were up against the greatest fighting force in the world ... something the Japanesse were learning the hard way ... Never kick a sleeping dog !

May God bless our country !!They were up against the GREATEST MANUFACTURING FORCE IN THE WORLD.

In the beginning of WW II our military was ranked somewhere around 15th in the world.

The sleeping dog was our industrial might which we turned into the the greatest arsenal ever seen on the planet.


"Indeed, it was long recognized that the six Ordnance manufacturing arsenals could produce, in time of war, only about 4 or 5 per cent of the critical requirements for weapons, ammunition, fire-control instruments, aircraft bombs, and mechanized equipment. Now that we were in the midst of a war of unprecedented magnitude, Industry would have to take over 95 to 96 per cent of the armament manufacturing program.


Without the invaluable assistance of Industry, we of the Ordnance Department would be in the position of General Robert E. Lee when he heard that Stonewall Jackson had lost his left arm. General Lee's message was: "You have lost your left arm, but I have lost my right."


Lt. Gen. Levin H. Campbell, Chief of Ordnance, United States Army, 1942-1946
The Industry-Ordnance Team, 1946
p. 5



The Robert Bosch Company of New York was created in 1906 to produce and sell magnetos, pumps, and other products of the Robert Bosch Company of Stuttgart, Germany, an old-line enterprise founded in1887. By 1930, the American company had a virtual monopoly on the U.S. Production of magnetos and fuel injection systems. Though American Bosch posed as an independent U.S.Company, in fact it had a contract with its German parent that required its permission as to what it produce, how much it produced,and to whom it sold its products. In the months leading up to U.S.entry into the world war and throughout 1942, American Bosch choked the U.S. production of diesel engines needed by the navy and others by delaying its production and delivery of essential fuel injection systems. In 1941 before the attack on Pearl Harbor, the navy desperately asked American Bosch to license its fuel injection technology to the Caterpillar Company. No answer was forthcoming. As soon as U.S. authorities understood that American Bosch was under German control; the Alien Property Custodian took over the company.The shortage was soon eliminated.


Pat Choate
Hot Property, The Stealing of Ideas inan Age of Globalization, 2005
p. 132-133



Until World War II, Swedish steel was used almost exclusively in manufacturing automotive valve spring wire. As in the case of razor blade steel, American steel circles realized that the war would compel this country to find a substitute for the Swedish steel.
In 1940, metallurgists of the American Steel & Wire Company successfully tackled the problem. They perfected a process which produced valve spring wire of superior quality. In grueling tests, valve springs made of the wire outlasted Swedish steel by a decisive margin. The Wire Company's accomplishment was a major war contribution, for valve springs of rugged dependability were imperatively needed to keep our jeeps, trucks ,tanks and planes in operation during the conflict.

Douglas A.Fisher, Office of Assistant to Chairman, United States Steel Corporation
Steel Serves the Nation, 1901-1951, The Fifty Year Story of United States Steel, 1951
p. 163


When the natural rubber supply from Southeast Asia was cut off at the beginning of World War II, the United States and its allies faced the loss of a strategic material. With U.S. Government sponsorship, a consortium of companies involved in rubber research and production united in a unique spirit of technical cooperation and dedication to produce a general purpose synthetic rubber, GR-S (Government Rubber-Styrene), on a commercial scale. In Akron and other U.S. locations, these companies, in collaboration with a network of researchers in government, academic, and industrial laboratories, developed and manufactured in record time enough synthetic rubber to meet the needs of the U.S. and its allies during World War II....


The onset of World War II cut off U.S. access to 90 percent of the natural rubber supply. At this time, the United States had a stockpile of about one million tons of natural rubber, a consumption rate of about 600,000 tons per year, and no commercial process to produce a general purpose synthetic rubber. Conserving, reclaiming, and stockpiling activities could not fill the gap in rubber consumption.....


The partnership of the government, industry, and academe expanded the U.S. synthetic rubber industry from an annual output of 231 tons of general purpose rubber in 1941 to an output of 70,000 tons a month in 1945.


“Today there are few who remember the near-disaster we faced in the winter of 1943 because of the shortageof fuel oil and gasoline. It was the coldest winter in memory. Temperatures were consistently sub-zero and many fuel oil dealers were receiving as many as two hundred calls a day from customers pleading for emergency delivery.


On January 5, 1943, I issued a public statement to underscore the magnitude of the crisis and the need for care. “Right now,” I said, “there is only one day's supply of fuel oil in dealers' supply tanks in the State of Connectitcut. Since mid-December there has never been more than three days' supply of fuel oil on hand at any one time.”


The fuel oil and gasoline shortage was largely caused by transportation difficulties. The pipe lines to carry petroleum products from Texas and Oklahoma to the East Coast had not yet been completed and the only means of transportation was by tankers, which were an easy target for German submarines. I was told one night fourteen blazing tankers were visible from the lighthouse at Cape Hatteras.


Our office, which had now moved to Ann Street in Hartford, was not exempt from these privations. In mid-December a headline appeared in the Hartford Times, “Penetrating Cold Penetrates OPA Office.” The article reported that some of our OPA employees had been sent home because we lacked oil to heat the office.


Our house in Essex was built in 1939 for a large family and a heavy flow of guests, and it normally consumed a lot of fuel. However, when fuel rationing began, we shut off all the heat in two-thirds of the house and lived in the rest. Our dining room became our living room, the nearby front hall was piled high with firewood, and with an open coal fire going day and night we, like millions of other families, nursed our sharply reduced oil supply through the winter.”


Chester Bowles
Promises to Keep: My Public Life:1941-1969,
Harper & Rowe, 1971
p. 24-25





BIG INCH PIPELINE


The manufacture of large diameter pipe was another research accomplishment of U.S. Steel for peace time service to our country which turned out to be of providential aid in World War II, when there was a serious shortage of oil and gasoline on the Atlantic seaboard due to the diversion of oil tankers for military service and the submarine menace. To overcome the shortage,the Big Inch line, the world's longest pipeline, was built from Texas to the New York-Philadelphia area. National Tube Company possessed the only plant in the country capable of making 24-inch seamless steel pipe.


During the war emergency, Big Inch transported almost 362,000,000 barrels of petroleum liquids. In the words of Harold L. Ickes, then Deputy Petroleum Administrator, “It would be difficult to overestimate the part which Big Inch has played in defeating the Axis powers. It would be equally difficult to make a precise appraisal of its contributions to the victory of the United Nations and the well-being of their citizens. With other means of transporting oil inadequate, Big Inch definitely became the facility which made it possible for us to meet the petroleum requirements of the Allied armies and thus shorten the war. It likewise prevented an oil shortage on the Atlantic seaboard.”


Douglas A. Fisher, Office of Assistant to Chairman, United States Steel Corporation
Steel Serves the Nation, 1901-1951, The Fifty Year Story of United States Steel, 1951
p. 176-177



The traditional method for making tinplate has been to dip a sheet of steel in molten tin, This is known as the hot-dip method. Since the United States is dependent on foreign sources of tin, the known reserves of which are limited, the Corporation many years ago began to concern itself with the problem of tin conservation. It launched itself upon the formidable task of developing a process whereby tin could be deposited on steel sheets electrolytically, with a more economical use of tin. After the successful operation of an experimental pilot plant, U.S. Steel in 1937 installed the first commercial electrolytic tinning line in America, at Gary, Indiana. The anticipated savings in tin were fully borne out. The new process was found to use 60 percent less tin than the hot-dip method. An electrolytic tinning line is a complicated apparatus about 200 feet long and costs millions of dollars.


A GODSEND TO THE COUNTRY


The electrolytic tin plating process proved to be a godsend to this country in World War II. The rapid conquest of the Malay States and the Dutch East Indies by the Japanese cut off 92 percent of our tin supply. The situation became serious. Our armed forces and those of our allies required very large quantities of canned foods. The limited stock pile of tin in America was not enough for both military and civilian needs, and the Army and Navy naturally had first claim on the existing reserves. So critical was the situation in 1942 that the Government planned to send all canned goods exclusively to our armed forces and to allied armies through Lend-Lease. The home front would have had little or no foods preserved in tin cans but for U.S. Steel's foresight and labors of research, which were responsible for the successful commercial application of the new process.


In the emergency, U.S. Steel suggested to the Government that more electrolytic tinning lines be built as rapidly as possible and offered to share its knowledge about the new process with other tin plate manufacturers. U.S. Steel built nine new electrolytic lines and other companies also installed them, making a total of 27 electrolytic tin plating units in this country during the war.


It has been estimated that U.S. Steel's electrolytic process saved sufficient tin in four years, from 1942 to 1945, to produce more than four and a half billion cans for packing food. That enabled the Government to spare tin for civilians, and that is why the home front, although strictly rationed, was able to buy any foods preserved in tin cans.


Douglas A. Fisher, Office of Assistant to Chairman, United States Steel Corporation
Steel Serves the Nation, 1901-1951, The Fifty Year Story of United States Steel, 1951
p. 146-147

And I could go on and on . . . .


Steve

BoxcabE50
May 22nd, 2013, 11:08 PM
My adobe pdf reader isn't working for some reason unknown to me. I can't open it up.

Steve

What version do you have installed? They are now up to v11.0.03.

machinehead61
May 22nd, 2013, 11:48 PM
I almost forgot about aluminum . . .


“Hitler's great worry about the amazing production of aluminum (Hitler sent Nazi saboteurs to America via U-boats to destroy aluminum plants – Steve) in America was because of its essential role in the Allied aircraft program which was spelling defeat for the Nazis. Production of military aircraft had increased from 6,000 planes in 1939 to 86,000 in 1943. A grand total of 304,000 military airplanes were turned out in the United States in the five and one-half years of defense preparation and of the war itself. It required 3,500,000,000 pounds of aluminum to produce them. The average aircraft of 1943, exclusive of engine, propeller and landing gear, weighed approximately three times as much as the 1939 airplane. Three fourths of this weight was aluminum. At the war peak, it was estimated that more than 85 per cent of Alcoa's output was going into the aircraft program.....


Civilian manufacture of aluminum products was either drastically curtailed or was nonexistent during the war......


February 1941 – Aluminum put on priorities to give all capacity to defense.....


...the Company (Alcoa) was producing in its own or Government-owned plants about 90 per cent of the aluminum requirements...


1943. The aluminum industry will have a capacity of over 2 billion pounds, seven times prewar. Alcoa has more than doubled its metal producing and fabricating capacity through a self-financed expansion program. The expansion by private industry has been augmented by a vast Government program where the kind, amount and time of expansion has been at the direction of the Government. In addition to operating its own twenty plants, Alcoa has been honored with the responsibility for constructing and operating 40 Government projects in 25 different locations....


Altogether, between the start of the defense program in May, 1940 and V-J Day, Alcoa produced 11.4 billion pounds of alumina, smelted 5.5 billion pounds of aluminum, and fabricated 2.7 billion pounds of sheet, 450 million pounds of extruded shapes, 500 million pounds of forgings, and 400 million pounds of castings.


At the end of World War II ownership of aluminum-producing facilities in the United States presented a vastly different picture from that which existed before the war. The Government emerged in the immediate postwar period as the largest owner of such facilities. It had $672,000,000 invested in 50 wholly-owned aluminum plants for either aluminum production or aluminum fabrication as compared to Alcoa's net investment of $474,000,000, a portion of which was borrowed money. Not all of the Government investment was useful for peacetime production...


It will be recalled that the Government program for building aluminum-producing plants was divided into two phases. The first phase included the building of plants which were located with an eye to their possible peacetime use. The second phase provided for the construction of aluminum producers in large industrial centers where the use of high-cost electrical energy made these particular plants definitely war-emergency projects."


Charles C. Carr
Alcoa, An American Enterprise, 1951
p. 247-261

And the steel industry in general . . .


….on May 10, 1939, when Hitler's blitzkrieg struck Western Europe like a thunderclap, the steel mills of this country had reached an annual capacity of 81,600,000 tons of steel.....


By the summer of 1941, however, when Britain was the last bastion of liberty in Europe, and ominous warlike signs were evident in Japan, the American Government with great urgency asked the steel industry to expand its capacity by 10,000,000 tons in the shortest possible time.....


It takes two to three years to build a steel mill....


In response to the government's request in 1941, the steel industry of America pitched in and built new furnaces, rolling mills and finishing equipment. Completely new steel mills were constructed. Some obsolete mills were called back into service. Year by year the steel capacity rose until it reached a record-breaking total of 95,500,000 tons in 1945.

This was 20,000,000 more tons than the maximum steel capacity at any time of our combined enemies.


Steel production mounted in proportion. To supply the basic metal for war, the steel plants of America by 1944 had increased their output 70 percent over 1939 and produced from January 1, 1940 to August 15, 1945, a grand total of 467,300,000 tons of steel.


Douglas A. Fisher, Office of Assistant to Chairman, United States Steel Corporation
Steel Serves the Nation, 1901-1951, The Fifty Year Story of United States Steel, 1951
p. 49-50

Note how total capacity increased from 81,600,000 tons in 1939 to 95,500,000 tons in 1945.

That is only a 17% increase.

Why?

Because “It takes two to three years to build a steel mill....”

But yet:

“...the steel plants of America by 1944 had increased their output 70 percent over 1939.”

How?


"At the beginning of the national emergency steel mills generally were operated far below maximum rated capacity. Chicago's, for example, were operated at 36% of rated capacity in the "bad" year of 1938; at 63% in 1939. By 1940 production was up to 82.6% of capacity, the national average to 81.97%. The peak was reached in 1942 when Chicago's average was 102.8% (late in May the area had a weekly average of 107), the national average, 98.1. The Chicago area had far surpassed its own and the national records in steel production for war. And at the end of the war it claimed precedence over Pittsburgh as the leading steel-producing center in the nation."

Mary Watters
Illinois In The Second World War, Volume II - The Production Front, 1952
p. 86


“Just before World War II, the West Coast region produced only 28 per cent of the 2,200,000 tons of finished steel which it consumed. Three years after the war, it produced 56 per cent of its finished steel consumption....

During World War II, the need arose for a greatly increased supply of steel plates and special forms of structural steel for the construction of ships on the Pacific Coast where the largest volume of merchant ships was being built, To meet the emergency demand, the government decided to build a large, integrated steel mill in Utah and called upon the engineering and operating experience of U.S. Steel to construct and operate it. The site chosen was Geneva, near Salt Lake City. There, U.S. Steel constructed and operated for the government, without charge or fee, the largest steel mill west of the Mississippi.”

Douglas A. Fisher, Office of Assistant to Chairman, United States Steel Corporation
Steel Serves the Nation, 1901-1951, The Fifty Year Story of United States Steel, 1951
p. 43-44

May we never forget that our nation's strength lies in its manufacturing.


Steve

machinehead61
June 3rd, 2013, 05:04 AM
Just got a better photo of this one from the gift shop in the Rochelle train park:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/576709_466564046765186_1050362751_n.jpg

Thanks to Ross Frier, Rochelle tourism.

Steve

BoxcabE50
June 3rd, 2013, 01:56 PM
I wonder what sort of protection that steel really offered? Small arms fire? Or more?

machinehead61
June 4th, 2013, 03:06 AM
I wonder what sort of protection that steel really offered? Small arms fire? Or more?It only amounted to 3 tons of armor which like you said, would stop small arms fire but not much else. Any aircraft with a 20mm cannon would open it up like a tin can. If the Axis had used .50 calibre machine guns like the Americans, they would have torn up these locomotives also. You should see the gun camera footage of a P-47 blowing up locomotives with its 8 - .50 calibre machine guns. One shot from a tank and it would be DOA.

It's why they disguised them as boxcars so they would survive air attack and never ran them up to the front lines unless by mistake. If the enemy had over run their lines - which Rommel did do - and they accidently ran a locomotive into combat, if they couldn't escape they'd try to destroy the engine before getting out of Dodge. It happened in North Africa.


What the crews did run into were demolition teams that the Nazis would smuggle behind lines. These teams besides carrying demolition charges also carried small arms and occasionally got into shoot outs with train crews. The train crews would carry small arms also. The Allies also learned quickly to guard the trains with MP's. The local Arabs would steal anything off the trains right in front of the crews. After North Africa, the MRS Battalions were issued their own MP units to ride with all trains throughout the ETO until the war ended.

Steve

machinehead61
June 4th, 2013, 03:34 AM
Here is an excellent WW II film (3 parts) of a P-47 Thunderbolt unit in Italy. After their bomb runs they would go low and hunt for ground targets to empty their 8 - .50's into and heaven help any locomotive that they caught.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3juQiY4ocPg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGBSh4peQ8o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGBSh4peQ8o

At the beginning of the 3rd part is gun camera footage of Thunderbolts straffing trains. They'd get the locomotive first which stopped the train, then they would turn around for more passes and strafe the rest of the cars in search for ammo. When they hit an ammo car the results were spectacular as the video shows.

Thunderbolts - nicknamed Jugs - were about 7 tons and about the heaviest single seat fighter the Allies had in WW II. They were extremely tough and could take a lot of damage which made them ideal for ground attack which draw a lot of ground fire. P-47's had air-cooled radials compared to Mustangs which were water-cooled. One small arms bullet into the cooling system and a Mustang would come down. The P&W R-2800 double radial air-cooled could have a jug shot off and still fly home.

At the 9:15 mark in the 3rd part is gruesome footage of a Thunderbolt that crash lands in a fireball. They drag out the charred remains of the pilot. Wasn't much left of him. They didn't attempt to glorify the war in this film.

Steve

machinehead61
June 12th, 2013, 07:16 PM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/427_471042752983982_898064222_n.jpg

From Baldwin Locomotives magazine, December 1942 issue.

Steve

machinehead61
July 3rd, 2013, 04:53 AM
JACKPOT !

For me, the Holy Grail of Whitcomb locomotive photographs would be of the camouflaged 65 ton Military Railway Service units serving in North Africa.

I have found such a photograph.

I did not know if any ever existed since the military was probably cautious about leaking out how we were doing it.

After Pearl Harbor was attacked, I've been told that no photography of the rail service from the ammo depot to Pearl Harbor was permitted for the duration of the war. Thus no Whitcomb photographs at Pearl Harbor exist from 1942-1945.

From a library loan - University of Chicago - comes this - Baldwin Magazine Third Quarter 1944:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1003277_480432565378334_578473198_n.jpg

I will attempt to produce a better quality photo of the lower left image.

Also - Baldwin Magazine Second Quarter 1945 confirms that Whitcomb 65 ton locomotives were the first to enter liberated Rome, Paris, Belgium, and Germany.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1043914_480436362044621_1628568448_n.jpg

Also will try to produce a better photograph tomorrow.

Steve

BoxcabE50
July 3rd, 2013, 04:57 AM
I am very surprised by all that you have unearthed. I had no idea tenacity would pay off this well.

machinehead61
July 3rd, 2013, 05:12 AM
I am very surprised by all that you have unearthed. I had no idea tenacity would pay off this well.

I also searched Northern Illinois University Library archives and had uncovered 9 unpublished Whitcomb photos - 2 from 1940 and 7 from 1949 shot in DeKalb just 20 miles east of Rochelle:

http://www.ulib.niu.edu/Reghist/Regional%20Collections.cfm#e

My adobe keeps screwing up so I can't see the Embree, W.W. collection but that is where this comes from.

The (2) 1940 photos are of a switcher in the DeKalb rail yard in brand new paint and "Whitcomb made in Rochelle" on the side.

The (7) 1949 photos are of an entire train load of crated Whitcombs on flat cars headed for Argentina stopped in the DeKalb rail yard.

They want $4 per photo to scan and copy to disc so $36 for the 9 photos. Our local museum has agreed to pay for it so hopefully tomorrow I can get that done.

Steve

machinehead61
July 3rd, 2013, 04:32 PM
I need a better camera than my Canon PowerShot A4000. It has auto focus and I can't over ride its flash choice. Time to save for a better camera.

This is my first attempt at a better image - not in the best focus and flash wouldn't go off.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1012163_480657938689130_780283881_n.jpg

I have a friend with a high end digital camera who has offered to help me out - I need it.

Steve

BoxcabE50
July 3rd, 2013, 06:18 PM
Where was that last photo taken? Looks like perhaps North Africa?

machinehead61
July 4th, 2013, 11:18 PM
Where was that last photo taken? Looks like perhaps North Africa?Exactly, North Africa during WW II. This is one of the camouflaged Whitcombs of the MRS that operated through Tunisia and Egypt in the campaign to push Rommel out of Africa 1942-1943.

Steve

machinehead61
July 6th, 2013, 04:35 AM
These images are from Baldwin Magazine Second Quarter 1945.

Due to the binding, I could not scan these pages without blurring at the center. Thus these are all camera photos.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/1001343_481708648584059_68650914_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1000699_481709045250686_1154702699_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1555_481710828583841_2044735641_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1011791_481707668584157_231083044_n.jpg

This article confirms that Whitcombs were the first Allied locomotives to enter liberated Rome, Paris, first supply and hospital trains into Belgium, first train into Germany, besides powering the first military train during WW II (North Africa).

Steve

BoxcabE50
July 6th, 2013, 05:16 AM
Maybe some day we will see a model of these in N scale.... :)

machinehead61
July 6th, 2013, 02:05 PM
Maybe some day we will see a model of these in N scale.... :)
I found this but I can't read nor understand the page, Italian?

http://www.lineamodel.it/benvenuti_in_lineamodel.htm

http://www.lineamodel.it/images/1808%20LM%20HO%20det5.jpg


http://www.lineamodel.it/images/1808%201M%20HO%20NE%20120%20det6.jpg

I can't find the price but I'll bet it's expensive being in brass.

I think I found the price -

169 Euro = $216.84 US Dollar

That is an expensive model for me.

Steve

machinehead61
July 13th, 2013, 04:12 AM
Just found this in a photo album here:

https://plus.google.com/photos/115544476866841256427/albums/5888961522809097713?authkey=CM3p_tD49MHmzQE#photos/115544476866841256427/albums/5888961522809097713

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/1004628_484894584932132_1776231754_n.jpg

Back of the photo states somewhere in France 1945.

Appears to be a pair of Whitcomb 65-ton diesel locomotives damaged by what I would guess was a collision. Photo taken from what appears to be a third Whitcomb.

Steve

BoxcabE50
July 13th, 2013, 05:33 AM
I found this but I can't read nor understand the page, Italian?

".it" is the TLD code for Italy.

BoxcabE50
July 13th, 2013, 05:35 AM
Just found this in a photo album here:

https://plus.google.com/photos/115544476866841256427/albums/5888961522809097713?authkey=CM3p_tD49MHmzQE#photos/115544476866841256427/albums/5888961522809097713

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/1004628_484894584932132_1776231754_n.jpg

Also interesting is the car at left side. It it says "Wrecking Car", but at a quick glance almost looks like the white lettering says "Wedding Car."

machinehead61
July 14th, 2013, 05:02 AM
Whitcomb 65-ton locomotives of the 732nd Railway Operating Battalion (ROB) crossing replacement bridge, Trier Germany, March 1945. Wreckage of original bridge seen to right in photo. The extent of the destruction in Europe was beyond what anyone could imagine.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/1017322_484958564925734_350973400_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/603167_485324844889106_110558646_n.jpg

The same train pulled by Whitcombs at Trier, Germany, March 1945 over replacement bridge by the 732nd Railway Operating Battalion. Wreckage of original bridge seen on right in photo.

Steve

machinehead61
July 30th, 2013, 01:17 AM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/521687_492921184129472_990077073_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/45200_492919424129648_246342008_n.jpg

Downtown DeKalb 1940 Whitcomb switcher.

From the Waite Embree collection NIU Regional History Collection.

http://archon.lib.niu.edu/index.php?p=collections%2Fcontrolcard&id=2&q=tobin

Waite Wagner Embree, the eldest of three children born to Elmer and Eva, was born November 27, 1905. After graduating from the University of Illinois, he joined his father and brother, Henry, as a partner in the E.E. Embree and Sons Lumber Yard.

In the bottom photo you can see the "Embree's" name on the building which locates these photos as downtown DeKalb, Illinois.


Steve

BoxcabE50
July 30th, 2013, 02:23 AM
Any ideas on the colors the engine was painted, these two most recent photos?

machinehead61
July 30th, 2013, 10:35 PM
Any ideas on the colors the engine was painted, these two most recent photos?

No idea. Black and white photography yields no secrets.

Steve

BoxcabE50
July 30th, 2013, 10:42 PM
It almost reminds me of orange and white, with perhaps a red separation stripe.

machinehead61
July 31st, 2013, 11:24 PM
It almost reminds me of orange and white, with perhaps a red separation stripe.I was guessing orange and white also.

A new (old) photo from NIU (Northern Illinois University):

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/954768_493846990703558_1166099432_n.jpg

Whitcomb locomotives enroute to delivery, DeKalb, IL. near the Chicago & North Western coal chute. Date: 1949, photograph by W.W. Embree courtesy of the NIU Regional History Center.

NIU has 9 Whitcomb photos in the Embree collection that have probably never been published before nor seen the light of day since donated back in March of 1967.

I asked if there were any Whitcomb photos and the NIU staff dug out the collection and these had been cataloged so they were easy to find.

Steve

machinehead61
August 2nd, 2013, 01:19 AM
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1013652_494360627318861_385439440_n.jpg

Whitcomb locomotives - I believe for export to Argentina, 1949, probably DeKalb area. Note broken windows - vandalism post WW II.

Ambree collection, NIU Regional History Center.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/19891_494365853985005_1611612352_n.jpg

A photo of Waite W. Embree of DeKalb, IL who took these photos and his family donated them to NIU in March, 1967.

From NIU Regional History Center collection.

Steve

BoxcabE50
August 2nd, 2013, 02:00 AM
Note broken windows - vandalism post WW II.

Disgraceful. And it has only become worse through today.

machinehead61
August 9th, 2013, 02:58 AM
I might be on to a surviving Whitcomb 65 ton WW II veteran locomotive up for possible donation. Rumor has it the unit is in running condition. Try to contact the gentleman tomorrow and go from there.

Steve

BoxcabE50
August 9th, 2013, 03:11 AM
I might be on to a surviving Whitcomb 65 ton WW II veteran locomotive up for possible donation. Rumor has it the unit is in running condition. Try to contact the gentleman tomorrow and go from there.

Steve

Oooooh! Good luck!

machinehead61
August 17th, 2013, 11:13 PM
Oooooh! Good luck!Still no reply. I'm guessing the contact might be on vacation.

In the interim I'm looking around for cost estimates to move a 65 ton locomotive from Mason City, Iowa to Rochelle, Illinois.

I wonder if any railroads could tow it on their line and drop it off on a siding in Rochelle. The BNSF and UP both have main lines going through town.

Steve

machinehead61
August 22nd, 2013, 11:59 PM
I contacted Lehigh Cement Company in Mason City, Iowa and they confirmed that they still own the Whitcomb and it does date back to WW II. They parked it about 3 years ago after experiencing traction motor problems and bought another locomotive to replace it.

They attempted to move it a number of years ago on a local UP line for some service work elsewhere but the UP inspected the Whitcomb and found that the wheels did not measure up to UP standards (flange problems? This unit was built in 1943 and designed for European service).

Some scrap dealers did look at it but nothing came from it. Perhaps it cost more to move than the scrap value since it can't be moved by rail.

The manager that oversees the locomotive has tried to contact me but my voice mail isn't working and I missed his calls. I will try to call him tomorrow.

Steve

machinehead61
September 8th, 2013, 03:48 AM
Update on the Whitcomb in Iowa - another group is interested in the unit. I'm in wait mode to see if they get it.

Another Whitcomb photo from WW II:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1240096_512776998810557_869531943_n.jpg

Steve

BoxcabE50
September 8th, 2013, 04:24 AM
Somehow, the words "service station" come across with the wrong mental picture. :)

Still hoping you can get that unit.

machinehead61
September 8th, 2013, 05:25 PM
"Service station" in a desert war front does send a mental picture that looks to me like a Standard gas station attendent wiping the windshield and asking if I want to fill her up with regular.

The manager in charge of the Whitcomb says he does not want the engine destroyed. He asked why Rochelle was interested in it and I gave him the history. He had no idea of what history was behind the locomotive he has and appreciates its historical value now.

Steve

paperkite
September 8th, 2013, 05:42 PM
Let us hope that you can broker a donation to Rochelle for history's sake ... Good luck Steve !!!

machinehead61
September 9th, 2013, 12:52 AM
Let us hope that you can broker a donation to Rochelle for history's sake ... Good luck Steve !!!

Absolutely. I talked to our tourism director and he is definitely interested in it. We have the space in our Railroad Park where our other two Whitcombs reside. This 65 ton unit would be the biggest yet and would probably go to the south where the city owns a grass lot which is used for overflow parking for the park.

The manager told me that this other group has yet to come up with any dollar figure.

If they back out, we might go apply for a state grant to help move the Whitcomb back home to where it was built. Right now our city government is going through some "restructuring" and the city manager might not be too receptive to spending tourism dollars on a 65 ton tourist attraction.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/599639_504945509593706_1437672987_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/998443_505885676166356_1971139406_n.jpg

Steve

machinehead61
September 9th, 2013, 01:14 AM
This is the 65 ton Whitcomb (65DE-19a) from WW II that now operates at the Wanamaker, Kempton and Southern in Kempton PA. This photo is from the gent that arranged the move.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/1175574_500771753344415_304353813_n.jpg

It still has its original Buda engines. The Mason City unit replaced its with Cummings.

It was moved by three flatbeds. Each Whitcomb truck weighs 15 tons and the body pictured above is 35 tons. The two trucks can go without overload permits. Only the body needs an overload permit and would require a pretty substantial crane to load & unload.

Steve

BoxcabE50
September 9th, 2013, 02:39 AM
What are all those protrusions from the cab?

machinehead61
September 9th, 2013, 03:07 AM
What are all those protrusions from the cab?

Don't know but they appear to be lights.

Steve

machinehead61
October 8th, 2013, 01:18 AM
https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1383283_526822994072624_1719968968_n.jpg

A friend photographed this out of the Baldwin Magazine and touched it up for contrast. The camouflaged Whitcombs in Africa during WW II.

Steve

BoxcabE50
October 8th, 2013, 02:30 AM
I wonder just jow many pilots were fooled by sheeting an engine to appear as a box car? Seems like either position in a train, or a side view would negate that effort.

machinehead61
October 8th, 2013, 11:57 PM
The Rochelle Newspapers, Popular Science, Trains and Baldwin Magazine all covered this story and all reported that it was very successful.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/554402_282930668461859_683357674_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/521865_282930891795170_156541752_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/389576_282931025128490_2074684996_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/578991_282933471794912_1483762327_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/524237_282933658461560_561952357_n.jpg

Steve

paperkite
October 9th, 2013, 04:08 PM
Thanks for posting, the engine disguised as box car was nifty trick that worked . I have seen many straffing videos and nearly all show the AC ( ours and theirs ) attacking from the rear focusing on the head end ... with the absence of steam I bet the axis pilots were confused as to which end to shoot at when stationary ...

machinehead61
October 10th, 2013, 01:12 AM
Thanks for posting, the engine disguised as box car was nifty trick that worked . I have seen many straffing videos and nearly all show the AC ( ours and theirs ) attacking from the rear focusing on the head end ... with the absence of steam I bet the axis pilots were confused as to which end to shoot at when stationary ...Makes sense, the pilot doesn't have to worry about leading the target if flying behind or in front. From those angles the locomotive/box car would be near impossible to detect, the pilot could only see the roof.

This is the only photograph that I have been able to find of the camouflaged Whitcombs. I would love to find the original and any others if they exist, but at least this photo does exist. I was afraid that like Pearl Harbor, photography would be prohibited due to security concerns.

Steve

machinehead61
October 10th, 2013, 01:35 AM
https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1390742_527613237326933_1900255549_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/1375952_527613720660218_1991244342_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1380499_527614110660179_1738302187_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/995202_527614907326766_1348511855_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/1380068_527615300660060_479877848_n.jpg

The bound volume of Baldwin Magazine came from University of Illinois Library and made scanning impossible - couldn't lay flat with the book being so thick. Had to photograph it.

Steve

BoxcabE50
October 10th, 2013, 01:44 AM
Ah. So those engine/box cars were buried in the train.

machinehead61
November 26th, 2013, 01:07 AM
https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/1463175_550784735009783_1282075194_n.jpg

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1459172_550784975009759_1038320309_n.jpg

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1450896_550785091676414_1798458917_n.jpg

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/999804_550785198343070_976472635_n.jpg

Some more Whitcomb adds from WW II Baldwin Magazines.

I've been gone for a while. I had a mini stroke (1-2mm) on November 13th at work and have been doing a bit of testing. I'm fine and feel better than ever. Doctor said I was lucky and I'm following their orders.

Steve

paperkite
November 26th, 2013, 03:25 PM
Steve,
Glad to hear your stroke was minor ... still , enough to make things slow down . I take blood thinners etc . sure make the mouth dry ... Thanks for posting the fotos of the book, the steam shovel loading is way cool with the steamer shoving !! ( must be a Baldwin eh ? )

BoxcabE50
November 26th, 2013, 04:02 PM
Sorry to read of the stroke. Glad to know all will be well!

Any news updates on preservation efforts for that one engine?

machinehead61
November 28th, 2013, 01:11 AM
Any news updates on preservation efforts for that one engine?Due to your question I called the gentleman and he says that the engine is still available to us. I have talked to our city manager and he seems interested. I now have to light a fire under him to get a study started on the cost of moving this Whitcomb back home and submit a proposal to the company that owns it.

By the way, that same company has another diesel locomotive retired that is up for adoption. It appears to be an EMD SW1 in Thorton, Illinois.

Steve

BoxcabE50
November 28th, 2013, 01:24 AM
Sounds like really good news to me. Hope they're willing to allow you the time, to get an effort rolling.

An SW1? Might not seem to be an exciting engine for some folks, but their numbers have been slowly shrinking. If nobody steps up for it, that will be a very sad ending.

machinehead61
November 28th, 2013, 01:36 AM
Sounds like really good news to me. Hope they're willing to allow you the time, to get an effort rolling.
The engine has sat for 3 years and the gentleman is hoping to save it from destruction. He says no big rush - wait until after the holidays to get serious.


An SW1? Might not seem to be an exciting engine for some folks, but their numbers have been slowly shrinking. If nobody steps up for it, that will be a very sad ending.The IRM owns an SW1 and it is the only locomotive cab that I have ever riden in. I have a video of it on Facebook but don't know if it would link here.

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/946816_453929741361950_1884157102_n.jpg
At the Illinois Railway Museum 5-4-2013

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/420640_453928774695380_1334797236_n.jpg
Me after riding in the EMD SW1

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/946816_453929721361952_609574550_n.jpg
My brother-in-law (left with the Sox shirt) in the cab. He drove it that day.

Steve

BoxcabE50
November 28th, 2013, 02:36 AM
SW1 are cool little workers. I had a deal to buy one, a little over twenty five years ago. But could not locate any place to keep it. So, it ended up being scrapped. :(

machinehead61
November 28th, 2013, 03:11 AM
49-0158
General Motors Locomotive
Model # SW1
Serial # 1017
Engine Model # 6-567
Engine Serial # 887
Thornton, Illinois
Running condition

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/1450858_551798291575094_1904388647_n.jpg

https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/1422511_551798494908407_164034507_n.jpg

If interested I can get you the phone number.

Steve

BoxcabE50
November 28th, 2013, 03:24 AM
49-0158
General Motors Locomotive
Model # SW1
Serial # 1017
Engine Model # 6-567
Engine Serial # 887
Thornton, Illinois
Running condition

I've seen these in far worse condition. Decent batteries? Is this the original owner?

Oh for my younger days, and those better finances I had back then.

machinehead61
November 29th, 2013, 11:06 PM
I posted this SW-1 in Railway Preservation News and in 2 days it has over 1,000 views and 5 offers from museums and one individual who want the locomotive.
Power of the internet.

And the guy who is in charge of this unit just asked me if I knew anyone who might want it.

I'd say so.

Steve

BoxcabE50
November 30th, 2013, 12:17 AM
Yup. At least it should now find a new home. Hope it is a good one!

machinehead61
December 2nd, 2013, 11:28 PM
https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1471854_554128331342090_109795881_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1425797_554128211342102_1905824794_n.jpg

In the first quarter of 1944, Baldwin changed magazines and consolidated two into one.

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1425615_554129051342018_1964403219_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1466166_554129258008664_1170716226_n.jpg


Steve

machinehead61
December 3rd, 2013, 02:22 PM
Just for laughs:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Locomotive-Serial-No-40799-/221311923288?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item338737f458

At $25,000 these people will never sell this Whitcomb. Get real.

Steve

BoxcabE50
December 3rd, 2013, 03:17 PM
The price is beyond all reality, even for several of them. Fascinating that there is no information given at all, about condition. Even worse, the category where it is listed:
Home & Garden>
Tools>
Air Compressors
Business & Industrial>
Manufacturing & Metalworking>
Other

This is not being offered by someone who thought carefully before creating a listing. :(

machinehead61
December 5th, 2013, 12:31 AM
You are 100% correct Boxcab. The person is off in la-la land. Absolutely no details that would be critical to deciding whether or not to buy the unit - and $25,000 ????? Greedy cup runneth over.

Steve

machinehead61
December 9th, 2013, 02:01 AM
Not directly linked to Whitcomb even though Baldwin owned Whitcomb by then and some of these engines were installed in Whitcomb units. I just thought some folks here might enjoy the information.

From Baldwin Magazine Third Quarter 1944.

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1425794_557371941017729_889106977_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/558087_557372211017702_1826680127_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/575429_557372424351014_23746227_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/1497734_557372491017674_1777697866_n.jpg

Steve

machinehead61
December 9th, 2013, 02:05 AM
https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1456051_557372794350977_1304386603_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1450096_557373017684288_8877184_n.jpg

https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/1454571_557373161017607_362860089_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1483061_557373291017594_974532655_n.jpg

Steve

melling
January 5th, 2014, 04:45 PM
Yours is a worthy cause, Steve, and wish you all the luck in research and publishing!

If you are interested in Whitcomb's WW2 locomotive production, I would recommend consulting R. Tourret's "Allied Military Locomotives of the Second World War (http://www.tourretpublishing.com/AlliedMilitaryLocomotivesOfWW2.htm)" which contains specific chapters on the two similar-looking but different 65 Ton models produced en masse for the war effort as well as tabulated information about other Whitcombs acquired by the USA/TC for use in Hawaii and various ordnance plants.

You can get an impression of the importance of the Whitcombs in the Middle East war effort from the following pictures, showing at least 17 of them at the Az-Zib depot, south of the then-Palestin-Lebanon border and the handing-over point between civilian (Palestine Railways) and military (British War Department) operations on the newly-built Haifa-Beirut-Tripoli line.
60559

Chen Melling

machinehead61
January 6th, 2014, 07:11 AM
Thank you very much Chen. Where did you find the photograph? Do you have others? The one you posted is fantastic.

I plan on going to the California State Railway Museum this spring and dive into their Whitcomb records. They have all the production records.

Taking the train out there of course.

Steve

melling
January 7th, 2014, 02:36 PM
The picture at Az-Zib was found in the collection of the late Paul Cotterell when I took it to the Israel Railway Museum, where I am the current manager.

It was used in his book "Make Straight the Way (http://www.rail.co.il/EN/Fun/Pages/Book.aspx)" about the history of railways in Israel, published by my employers, Israel Railways Ltd. The book also includes the two following Whitcomb views:
60586
Above is a 1944 view in Beirut, where an un-identified 65-Tonner is juxtaposed with the diminutive looking British (War Department) 25 Ton brake van, based on a Southern Railway design. Photo by K.R.M Cameron.

60587
The second photo was taken by D.S. Currie at a dock alongside the Suez Canal with the S.S. Clan Chisholm as a backdrop. WD 71233 (nee 1233) and a classmate are probably due to be loaded on the ship on their way to Italy. I don't know what the WS 378 designation on both locos stands for.

Note that the two pictures show a slight difference in cab profile - this is represented in the diagrams presented earlier in this thread.

Chen

machinehead61
January 7th, 2014, 09:13 PM
Chen, your two links; Attachment 60586 and Attachment 60587 did not work for me. I could not access them.

I would be EXTREMELY interested in these photos and any others that you know of from your area of Whitcombs during WW II.

I tried to email a war museum in Egypt but never got a response.

Is there any WW II history in Paul Cotterell's book describing Whitcomb operations? I might buy a copy if there is.

I have located the original negatives of the Whitcomb photos in Africa that Baldwin published in their magazine. I can send you the link if interested.

Steve

BoxcabE50
January 8th, 2014, 12:01 AM
For some reason, the attachments did not finish loading properly.

machinehead61
January 8th, 2014, 12:41 AM
So it just wasn't me. Sure hope Chen can send them. I would love to see what he has and any history from WW II in his area.

Steve

melling
January 8th, 2014, 03:30 AM
Let's try again:
60615
Above is a 1944 view in Beirut, where an un-identified 65-Tonner is juxtaposed with the diminutive looking British (War Department) 25 Ton brake van, based on a Southern Railway design. Photo by K.R.M Cameron.

60616
The second photo was taken by D.S. Currie at a dock alongside the Suez Canal with the S.S. Clan Chisholm as a backdrop. WD 71233 (nee 1233) and a classmate are probably due to be loaded on the ship on their way to Italy. I don't know what the WS 378 designation on both locos stands for.

Note that the two pictures show a slight difference in cab profile - this is represented in the diagrams presented earlier in this thread.

BoxcabE50
January 8th, 2014, 03:42 AM
Note that the two pictures show a slight difference in cab profile...

I am thinking a good guess about this would be some sort of clearance issue?

machinehead61
January 8th, 2014, 01:46 PM
I am thinking a good guess about this would be some sort of clearance issue?

My guess also. The lower cab profile Whitcombs were seen in the European Theater of Operations (ETO) where tunnels and other structures were probably older than in Africa and thus I suspect smaller due to the smaller size of the early locomotives.

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1466166_554129258008664_1170716226_n.jpg

From the second paragraph:

"Continental tunnel clearances dictated the contour of the cab roof in many cases"


Steve

machinehead61
January 8th, 2014, 02:08 PM
Let's try again:
60615
Above is a 1944 view in Beirut, where an un-identified 65-Tonner is juxtaposed with the diminutive looking British (War Department) 25 Ton brake van, based on a Southern Railway design. Photo by K.R.M Cameron.

60616
The second photo was taken by D.S. Currie at a dock alongside the Suez Canal with the S.S. Clan Chisholm as a backdrop. WD 71233 (nee 1233) and a classmate are probably due to be loaded on the ship on their way to Italy. I don't know what the WS 378 designation on both locos stands for.

Note that the two pictures show a slight difference in cab profile - this is represented in the diagrams presented earlier in this thread.

Fantastic Chen. Thank you so very much. Is there anything that I can help you with?

The Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania ended up with these original negatives from Baldwin (who owned Whitcomb from 1931 until it was closed in 1952) and are not available elsewhere. Reproductions are not cheap. I'm going to buy one of the negatives of the camouflaged 65-ton locomotive in Africa and present it to our museum board to see if they will pay for more. These negatives were saved from being thrown out by Baldwin employees after the plant was closed who grabbed them out of filing caninets and even dumpsters I was told. Thank God they did.

Please let me know about that book that your museum offers. If it contains WW II history and Whitcomb I'll want to buy it.

http://rrmuseumpa.andornot.com/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx?AC=GET_RECORD&XC=/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx&BU=http%3A%2F%2Frrmuseumpa.andornot.com%2FArchives %2F&TN=RRMPArchives&SN=AUTO20106&SE=1723&RN=1&MR=20&TR=0&TX=1000&ES=0&CS=0&XP=&RF=WebBrief&EF=&DF=WebFullSuggest&RL=0&EL=0&DL=0&NP=255&ID=&MF=RailRoadWPEngMsg.ini&MQ=&TI=0&DT=&ST=0&IR=146243&NR=0&NB=0&SV=0&SS=0&BG=&FG=&QS=&OEX=ISO-8859-1&OEH=utf-8

http://rrmuseumpa.andornot.com/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx?AC=GET_RECORD&XC=/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx&BU=http%3A%2F%2Frrmuseumpa.andornot.com%2FArchives %2F&TN=RRMPArchives&SN=AUTO20106&SE=1723&RN=0&MR=20&TR=0&TX=1000&ES=0&CS=0&XP=&RF=WebBrief&EF=&DF=WebFullSuggest&RL=0&EL=0&DL=0&NP=255&ID=&MF=RailRoadWPEngMsg.ini&MQ=&TI=0&DT=&ST=0&IR=146237&NR=0&NB=0&SV=0&SS=0&BG=&FG=&QS=&OEX=ISO-8859-1&OEH=utf-8

http://rrmuseumpa.andornot.com/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx?AC=GET_RECORD&XC=/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx&BU=http%3A%2F%2Frrmuseumpa.andornot.com%2FArchives %2F&TN=RRMPArchives&SN=AUTO20106&SE=1723&RN=2&MR=20&TR=0&TX=1000&ES=0&CS=0&XP=&RF=WebBrief&EF=&DF=WebFullSuggest&RL=0&EL=0&DL=0&NP=255&ID=&MF=RailRoadWPEngMsg.ini&MQ=&TI=0&DT=&ST=0&IR=146244&NR=0&NB=0&SV=0&SS=0&BG=&FG=&QS=&OEX=ISO-8859-1&OEH=utf-8

http://rrmuseumpa.andornot.com/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx?AC=GET_RECORD&XC=/Archives/ViewArchives.aspx&BU=http%3A%2F%2Frrmuseumpa.andornot.com%2FArchives %2F&TN=RRMPArchives&SN=AUTO20106&SE=1723&RN=3&MR=20&TR=0&TX=1000&ES=0&CS=0&XP=&RF=WebBrief&EF=&DF=WebFullSuggest&RL=0&EL=0&DL=0&NP=255&ID=&MF=RailRoadWPEngMsg.ini&MQ=&TI=0&DT=&ST=0&IR=146245&NR=0&NB=0&SV=0&SS=0&BG=&FG=&QS=&OEX=ISO-8859-1&OEH=utf-8


Steve

melling
January 8th, 2014, 08:03 PM
Steve, the Africa pictures are very interesting, so thanks for these links.




I would be EXTREMELY interested in these photos and any others that you know of from your area of Whitcombs during WW II.

Is there any WW II history in Paul Cotterell's book describing Whitcomb operations? I might buy a copy if there is.

I have located the original negatives of the Whitcomb photos in Africa that Baldwin published in their magazine. I can send you the link if interested.

Steve

Paul Cotterell's book, and his previous one on the subject "The Railways of Palestine and Israel (http://www.tourretpublishing.com/TheRailwaysOfPalestineAndIsrael.htm)" both try to cover a large subject, so while they have plenty of wonderful pictures (I will try to find the sources for the Whitcomb ones in the first book, which I haven't uploaded ) they cannot delve to much into details, especially the new one. Both contain only a few paragraphs relating the use of the Whitcombs in Palestine and the Sinai, in both cases as part of the single chapter devoted to the 1940s.

I am actually (generally) familiar with Whitcomb's history, mostly from on-line sources, though this thread has certainly deepened my knowledge of the subject. I am also aware of the status of Baldwin archival preservation, as this was the most prolific supplier of locomotives to this country, both in terms of total numbers and in diversity of types.

While I heartily would recommend the "Make Straight the Way" book to any railway enthusiast, the Whitcomb researcher would find the Tourret WW2 book much more useful. Below are a couple of source-material snippets of the type used in the compilation of the latter book.
60720

This next excerpt relates to the military-operated portion of the Haifa-Beirut-Tripoli line:
60721

machinehead61
January 9th, 2014, 01:27 AM
Steve, the Africa pictures are very interesting, so thanks for these links.The very least that I can do for you.




Paul Cotterell's book, and his previous one on the subject "The Railways of Palestine and Israel (http://www.tourretpublishing.com/TheRailwaysOfPalestineAndIsrael.htm)" both try to cover a large subject, so while they have plenty of wonderful pictures (I will try to find the sources for the Whitcomb ones in the first book, which I haven't uploaded ) they cannot delve to much into details, especially the new one. Both contain only a few paragraphs relating the use of the Whitcombs in Palestine and the Sinai, in both cases as part of the single chapter devoted to the 1940s.Is the Whitcomb information the same in both books?


I am actually (generally) familiar with Whitcomb's history, mostly from on-line sources, though this thread has certainly deepened my knowledge of the subject. I am also aware of the status of Baldwin archival preservation, as this was the most prolific supplier of locomotives to this country, both in terms of total numbers and in diversity of types.I found a numer of mistakes relating to Whitcomb history on the net which I corrected in the Wikipedia article which now stands correct to the best of my knowledge.


While I heartily would recommend the "Make Straight the Way" book to any railway enthusiast, the Whitcomb researcher would find the Tourret WW2 book much more useful. Below are a couple of source-material snippets of the type used in the compilation of the latter book.
60720

This is excellent, where did it come from?


This next excerpt relates to the military-operated portion of the Haifa-Beirut-Tripoli line:
60721What does "WD" stand for? The breaking down of Whitcombs I suspect was due to their Buda cylinder heads which were very prone to cracking. See elsewhere in this thread references to this problem. Thank you so much for this information, it is nearly impossible to find much information on Whitcomb history in your area.

Steve

melling
January 9th, 2014, 12:38 PM
In "The Railways of Palestine and Israel" it is mentioned that the Whitcombs were regularly working freights up the line to Jerusalem, when two double-headed a train from Kantara to the junction at Lydda during the night, one of which being used on the trip to Jerusalem before returning (I failed to find evidence for this in the surviving Working Time Tables). It is also said that they virtually monooplised traffic on the Haifa-Beirut-Tripoli line until replaced by steam engines in mid 1944. The second book has even less details.

The allocation listing is a copy from an official document, made by K.R.M Cameron, so I know little about the actual source, but a lot more of this kind of information is included in the Tourret book.

WD stands for (the British) War Department. By the way, the writers were wrong, as the American lend-lease equipment was not technically WD-owned, which led to some difficulties post-war.

melling
January 9th, 2014, 12:46 PM
The following are excerpts from the memoirs of a soldier in the WW2 Middle East, as collected by Rabbi Dr. Rothschild. The text is a bit of a mess, but contains some snipets reagrding Whitcomb (not ALCo!) operations here:


BERT DYKE - A LIFE.
Taken from discussion/interview 18/5/2000, and various Letters.
(Edited by Rabbi Walter Rothschild)



Part 15. The Western Desert.

An article in "Railway Magazine" for March/April 1944 p.72f (&125) has a photo by P.J. Bawcutt of a freight topped and tailed by Whitcomb diesels 1213 & 1219 near Tobruk. Capt. P. J. Bawcutt R.E. was an ex-ROD bloke, and came from our own GWR (Wolverhampton Division) - he also wrote about Iran, he and I seemed to be the only ones who thought the MEF was worth recording!

Part 37. Back at the Wharf.

… the South Africans were from Natal (Durban, George, Port Elizabeth) and had the German view of "Uitlanders" (or Untermenschen). And daft HQ had sent a 40-odd-year old Captain, an alcoholic, in charge, to get him out of the way. He knew it, they knew it, and the gangs were drifting away, in spite of there being more work than ever. I slept in Capt. Kirkwood’s tent and he just was never sober; as fat as he was tall, a Liverpool man. First thing was to get the South African CSM interested, so I rolled him down to Kantara East on Diesel 1205, and introduced him to the 182 Railway Operating Coy. mob (a few still left), and a lot of USA railroaders - he’d not even been down there!

Think about that small wharf at Kilo 40 - as I spoke the "Danmark" was sliding out into the fairway, and a British India Line cargo/passenger ship "Rahmani" was sidling in. I thought she smelt funny, how right I was. Cargo of copra. COPRA! She wafted a sweet, pong over dock, desert and Palestine. You may well ask what the hell we had copra for - well, it was going to Rafa, not faraway. Nothing there, was there? And copra really needs bagging or it flops about like rice pudding. In fact, it was destined for feeding mules - there was an Indian Mule Coy. based at Rafa. All we had at that moment were 25 low-sided bogies - including the Hungarian 36-tonner - I stayed on the dock all night, and had a little "promise" to my lovely lads that whichever gang got the most loaded on the bogies, got 100 Piastres from me. All went well, and daft as it may sound, I got them to take yards of scrim-netting out of the vast mountain of camouflage there, and tie it round the bodies of the opens! We had no tarpaulins ("m’shemmas mafeesh" as they told me), and the MAV wagon had over 6 tons on it - bound up like a mummy - and dear old Hamouda’s gang got the 100 ackers! Altogether, we got shot of over 150 tons right away, and Alco diesel 1229 - with my sceptical Yank Captain, brought in 25 of the ESR opens, just as I’d asked for, at 3.30am. - so, in spite of protests we had another trainload ready by breakfast time. The S.A. Sgt. Major (Willie Botha) was open-mouthed - "How come they work for you?" Well, the South African Engineers all carried switches (canes), and used them too. You don’t have to spell it out, do you?
I’d hardly "got my head down" when Willie woke me up, he was cursing in Afrikaans - 1205 was one bogie off at the points, and 1229 come to rescue her - I’d seen all that before, and said "Leave it to the Yanks and our men". "But they’ve only got wood dunnage!" he said. "Leave them" was my advice .... they had that bogie on in a quarter of an hour, even though their Top Sergeant was drunk! Then I actually had some sleep. So we cleared "Rahmani" and she went on her odorous way, by means of a shuttle service El Kantara - Rafa, using any loco operative, including many armoured Alcos, and definitely breaking speed limits as the crews tried to keep ahead of the smell!

An even older British India ship "Jalavara" was dragged in by a Dutch destroyer, loaded with salvaged Spitfires, Hurricanes and general scrap, with (once again) sheep wandering all over the decks. So just as Diesel 1551 - an armoured loco - dragged in a few 50-tonners, we had to pack up. …

machinehead61
January 10th, 2014, 01:02 AM
Fascinating and some what hard to understand the British slang and its meaning. I got home late from work tonight so I haven't much time to ask questions but will have more tomorrow. Thank you very much Chen.

Steve

melling
January 10th, 2014, 06:52 AM
In the World War 2 Railway Study Group Bulletin for June 2013 (Vol. 23 No. 3) there is a short article by the late Wynford Fear, a military locomotive driver in WW2, who describes the technical aspects of the Whitcombs, and also comments one their usefulness:

These locos were very good for the job they were meant for.
...
These machines were very good but they ran for 24 hours per day and most were recording as
much as 10,000 miles per week. After two years the cylinder heads were cracking. Attempts were
made to weld them but without success. If the powers-that-be had been prepared to put in new
engines instead of the worn-out Buda diesels they would have run for many more years.


Of course, the Italian State Railways (FS) did exactly that, with the expected results.

machinehead61
January 11th, 2014, 04:34 PM
In the World War 2 Railway Study Group Bulletin for June 2013 (Vol. 23 No. 3) there is a short article by the late Wynford Fear, a military locomotive driver in WW2, who describes the technical aspects of the Whitcombs, and also comments one their usefulness:


Of course, the Italian State Railways (FS) did exactly that, with the expected results.I haven't heard of similar problems with the GE and Alco units which also were sent over seas during the war.

In another forum I was told this by a gent who helped restore and operate a 65-ton Whitcomb from WW II :

http://www.rypn.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33922&start=45


This thread has been very interesting. From my experience, the 65-ton Military centercab is a rather interesting beast. They had two (2) Buda DCS-1879 engines for a "rating" of 650hp and were MU-capable. The engines were found to be of poor design, mostly due to insufficient coolant flow through the heads, leading to head cracking. They employed the "Lanova" principle for combustion, complete with a separate energy cell. Due to the size of the engines and the generators, 2 banks of batteries, each being 32-volts, were needed to operate the starting winding and start the engines. The contactor arrangement is somewhat unique in the starting/charging circuit. Rated top speed of 46 mph, I was told they were run in multiple on coal trains in Germany during the war, not so much for the horsepower but to ensure the train made the terminal due to probable engine failure.

The shot of the one up on blocks reminded me of a motor swap we did several years ago. This work will need to be repeated. Note the locomotive in the background up on blocking and jacks. The truck is rather basic but the large wheels (42") and fact that it is a fabricated truck is a testament to the Whitcomb engineers.

Also, back after the Whitcomb arrived, I had occasion to speak with a fine gentleman at the remains of Baldwin who indicated that they were still supplying some repair parts for Whitcombs still in service. This was circa 1987.


The story of the multiple unit coal trains came from a guy who was in the USATC and stationed there in WWII. After the 602 arrived and we were working on it, several people showed up who had been in military service during WWII and told us some stories. A few wrote letters of their tour of duty and one guy had some photos he shared with me. The story was that they would MU 3 of the 65-tonners together as they were certain at least one would fail enroute. Once, after we had the 602 up and running well, we figured out why the Germans surrendered with 3 of these things bearing down on them at full-bore! Those Buda's make a lot of noise. And to start one is much more than just closing the battery switch and pushing a button.

Steve

machinehead61
January 11th, 2014, 04:50 PM
Here is the website of the railroad museum that operates the only Whitcomb 65-DE-19a that still has its original Buda engines in it.

http://www.kemptontrain.com/equipment/

And some information on these units:

http://www.jeff-z.com/wks/locoroster/602/rhp.html


L&NE #601 was constructed by the Whitcomb Locomotive Company, of Rochelle, IL, at the time a subsidiary of Baldwin Locomotive Works. It was built as part of an order for 99 similar locomotives for the US Army Transportation Corps in 1944. These locomotives were numbered in the 8400-8498 series, bearing Whitcomb serial numbers 60406-60504. They were classified by Whitcomb as 65-DE-19a, the 65 standing for the gross weight in tons, the DE standing for diesel electric drive, and the 19a believed to bear a relationship concerning the production run number from the first run of that particular model. The Army specification called for a locomotive to be able to run on any european main line, have a top speed of at least 45 mph, and must be capable pf operating in multiple unit with similar locomotives. L&NE #601 was constructed with serial number 60458, USATC #8452, re-numbered by the Military Railway Service upon arrival in Italy to #1362. While in Italy, it was used in a variety of service, ranging from yard duty to operating in MU with other Whitcombs on coal trains.

WK&S #602 had a similar history at the time of construction. It was constructed with serial number 60473 and bore the number USATC #8467. While no definite information has surfaced, it is believed that #602 was shipped to France or Belgium for use during the war. These locomotives were shipped overseas in three large crates, one each for each assembled truck and one large crate containing the locomotive frame and carbody, totally assembled. From information in a Whitcomb locomotive manual, apparently the locomotives were equipped with standard AAR couplers for shipment to the Port of Embarkation, removed prior to shipment and european couples applied upon delivery in Europe.

Whitcomb constructed the locomotives in accordance with standard locomotive practice for the 1940's era. Two Buda (correctly pronounced beauda) DCS-1879, 283 HP at 1200 RPM, engines were used for prime movers in each locomotive. The horsepower rating of this particular engine has been misstated in various publications but the 283 HP appears in both Whitcomb manuals and official US Army publications. These engines were supercharged and had 1879 cubic inch displacement. They utilized the "Lanova" principle of combustion that relies on an internal "energy cell" to provide complete combustion of diesel fuel oil. The electrical equipment was supplied by Westinghouse Electric & Manufacturing Co. and consisted of two 197-A main generators, four 970-A traction motors and the various standard Westinghouse control equipment. With a 14:72 gear ratio and 42 inch diameter wheels, the locomotive had a maximum speed limit of 46½ MPH, quite fast for a military locomotive of the time. As was the practice in early diesel electric locomotives, the main generators were located away from the cab, with the radiators placed close to the cab. It was believed at the time that this provided for the cooling air to be blown away from the electrical cabinet and away from the cab in an effort to keep the cab cool. It was later proved that running the main electrical cables through the engine rooms was far more detrimental to the life of the locomotive than the benefits of a cooler cab.

The locomotives served the military well during World War II. Whitcomb received an Army-Navy "E" Award in January, 1944, for outstanding production of these military locomotives. These locomotives were used to pull the first train into the city of Rome after it was taken from the Germans. They pulled the first train across the Rhine River after the Corp of Engineers rebuilt a bombed out bridge. Whitcomb 65 tonners pulled the first train into Paris after it was liberated by the Allies and pulled the first supply trains and hospital trains into Belgium after that country was taken back by the Allies. While they were cantankerous and somewhat a maintenance headache, particularly the Buda diesel engines, they ran and often ran well. I spoke with an ex-MRS locomotive mechanic several years ago and he provided some interesting information about his tour of duty in Italy. The Buda diesel engines had heads that were prone to cracking due to a design flaw that provided too little cooling across the length of the head. As locomotives were laid up for relatively minor repairs, the mechanics would scrounge parts from the offending locomotive, mostly the heads, rendering the locomotive inoperative. The mechanic also stated that many of the trains were equipped with at least two, and sometimes three, Whitcombs for fear of breakdowns out on the road. He said they could pull well and were liked on coal train duty.

After VE day in 1945, the USATC decided that many of these Whitcombs were worth rehabilitating and being shipped to the Far East to fight in the war against Japan. 118 of these locomotives were shipped back to the US. By the time the locomotives arrived in the US, the hostilities ended in Japan. They arrived at Hawkins Point, near Baltimore, MD, and were stored pending disposition. With the war over, the US government disposed of these locomotives beginning in 1947. Most of the locomotives were sold through brokers to industrial operations or shortlines. The only modification that occurred to these locomotives was the removal of the european couples and the installation of bolt-on AAR coupler pockets and couplers. Whitcomb, however, repurchased some of the locomotives. These locomotives were rebuilt and reclassified to 70-DE-26. These rebuilt locomotives now weighed 70 tons and were equipped with wider cabs, side walkway extensions, side handrails, a larger oil reservoir, and spring-equipped draft gear couplers. Most of the rebuilds also had their MU gear removed.

L&NE #601 was purchased from the US government in February, 1947. The locomotive was not modified to a 70 ton configuration and retained its' as-built 65 ton appearance. It was purchased to replace the steam locomotive assigned to the Alpha Portland Cement mill in Martins Creek, PA. The Alpha mill contracted with the L&NE for switching duties and the L&NE thought it would be cheaper to use a diesel. The steam locomotive would require deadhead moves back and forth to Tadmor Yard for any type of servicing, let alone for monthly inspections. Also, the L&NE needed to have someone watch the steam locomotive during times of inactivity. All of this added up to unnecessary expenses that could be saved with the use of a diesel. Apparently, the benefits of diesel power through the use of #601 convinced management to pursue total dieselization in late 1947. #601 continued to be used until sometime in 1954. It was then sold to Panther Valley Coal Company in December, 1954 for use in the Lansford, PA area. It is unknown to the author when 601 was finally scrapped.

Several years ago, I spoke with ex-L&NE engineer Dick Powell about #601. He said that his first job upon qualifying as an engineer was running #601 at Martins Creek. Most of the work at Alpha consisted of spotting coal hoppers on the coal trestle. This operation included a procedure that, while it worked, was less than desirable. The locomotive would couple up to three hoppers, the limit of the trestle, and back up the "Woods Track" north of the Mill. The #601 would then "give it hell" and push the cars up the ramp. When the engine reached the top of the incline, the engineer would "dump" the air brakes, stopping the train before it flew off the end of the trestle. Mr. Powell never said whether a train went off the end! He said he liked running the locomotive because it was so much cleaner than the steam locomotives. He also remembers running the engine over to Tadmor for it's monthly inspection.

WK&S #602 has a much different past. Upon return to the US, it was repurchased by Whitcomb and rebuilt to a 70 ton configuration. Gulf Oil Corp. purchased two of these locomotives around 1950 for use at its Point Arthur, Texas refinery. They were numbered 7 and 8. Sometime around 1960, #7 was shipped to Philadelphia, PA to replace a smaller locomotive. It was used to move salt and catalyst cars along Pennypacker Avenue and the package department's black oil rack. In 1979, #8 was shipped to Philadelphia. This was done because parts were becoming scarce, and hence expensive, for Whitcomb locomotives. #8 would be used as a parts engine and never operated in Philadelphia. In 1983, #7 was out of service for an extended period of time and Gulf rented another locomotive. Finally, in 1984, Gulf purchased a Trackmobile and retired #7 permanently. Both locomotives were subsequently donated to the Cornell Railway Historical Society of Cornell, NY, for preservation. Unfortunately, the cost of moving both engines was well beyond the means of the Society and they were offered to the Anthracite Railroads Historical Society, due to the L&NE/Whitcomb connection. In 1987, the WK&S was approached about the possibility of leasing #7. #8 would be scrapped in place as it was partially disassembled. Any salvageable parts from #8 could be removed before scrapping. It was agreed to paint the locomotive in an L&NE paint scheme and renumber the locomotive 602. It was moved to Kempton in the fall of 1988 and rehabilitated for operation in 1989.

I hope that our town can save the 65-DE-19a that was retired in Mason City, Iowa and move it back to Rochelle where these were built. The Buda engines were replaced with Cummings but I would love to see it brought back home.

I have located and interviewed Bertrum Cote who worked at the Whitcomb factory during WW II until drafted in late 1944. He stated that the Army and Navy had representatives at the factory who upon successful trial running each unit would accept each locomotive which then would be disassembled before shipping. He still lives in Rochelle and is a great guy.

Steve

machinehead61
January 11th, 2014, 05:09 PM
https://scontent-a-ord.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash2/480293_378318945589697_724691210_n.jpg

This is a photo from the Army-Navy "E" award ceremony at Rochelle. On December 31, 1943 the War Department conferred the Army-Navy Production Award ("E" award) to the Whitcomb Locomotive Company and the presentation ceremony was held in the Rochelle plant on January 26, 1944.

Bert Cote is on the right holding the flag.

He said that he would run each locomotive for 15 miles to check for leakes and make sure everything worked. Then he was drafted and served in the 2nd Armored Division ( "Hell on Wheels" ) over in Europe in a half-track during WW II.

Steve

melling
January 11th, 2014, 07:32 PM
Below is a rather poor reproduction made by the late Paul Cotterell from an unknown source, showing three Whitcombs, probably in storage or under repair, at the Ez-Zib running shed (engine house), probably c. 1944
60764

I reviewed the surviving Palestine Railways Working Time Tables. The Diesels (as they are referred to there) only appear in WTT No. 3, which came into force on 1 May 1944, and are still there in ammendments issued during December of the same year, but not in WTT No. 4 on 1 November 1945.

On the Haifa-Lydda section of the PR Main Line, they were allowed 400 (metric) tons on goods (freight) timings singly or 760 tons double-headed, provided vacuum braking was in operation on at least 5 wagons (freight cars) otherwise 600 tons. They were not normally allowed to run on passenger timings, and under no circumstances were they allowed to double-head with a steam engine.
The values given for the Haifa-Ez-Zib section of the HBT-Line are the same, except that there is no differentiation between passenger and goods timings.
They are not mentioned on any other standard-gauge section of the time tables, nor in the table summarizing locomotive types and their leading particulars.

machinehead61
January 12th, 2014, 02:11 AM
Wonderful photograph. You are providing information unobtainable here in the states. I definitely want to include this in the book.

Steve

melling
January 12th, 2014, 03:30 AM
Steve,

You are can certainly use the info I post in your book, with proper credit to The Israel Railway Museum and respective photographers (where applicable). I will post more photos when I find them in our archive.

Please note that the WTT summary I posted is definitely not the whole story - I already posted evidence that the Whitcombs where regularly used on the other PR main lines, i.e. from Lydda to Jerusalem and across the Sinai Peninsula to Kantara East on the Suez Canal.

Chen

machinehead61
January 13th, 2014, 09:10 PM
I just talked to the California State Railway Museum in Sacremento and told them about your information and photos and they would love to see them. So if it is ok with you can I forward the information to them - with proper credit going to The Israel Railway Museum of course ? They have the entire record and files of all the Whitcomb production.

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1533843_575300525891537_252625369_n.jpg

746th Railway Operating Battalion, Germany c. 1945

Steve

melling
January 14th, 2014, 03:42 AM
By all means!

Chen